DSLRUsers.com

Hi All,

I'm after a 77mm Graduated Neutral Density ND.6 Hard Edge filter and i'm curious about the quality from the different manufacturers.

What are the following manufacters like.. are these pretty good quality? Number from 1 to x with 1 being the best. I want a filter that can just screw on via the lens thread so I think that rules out a few of these.

Lee
Hoya
Cokin
B+W
Formatt
Tiffen
Heliopan

I'm thinking of ordering some filters from somewhere and just curious which I should get. I might be wanting other types of filters too.

I have never used a grad ND filter, so take my comments accordingly, but I thought a screw on one would have prevented you from adjusting the graduation line relative to your frame - ie. it would always be in the middle of your frame?

Using a screw on ND grad filter will limit your composition as you won't be able to really align your graduation where YOU want it. You will have to align it where the manufacturer wanted to put it.

I use Cokin style ND grad filters using the P-Holder. The filters that I use are from Hitech. http://www.formatt.co.uk/default.aspx

If money is not an issue, then the Singh-Ray filters are the best you can probably get, I'm saving for some of them, have a look at:
http://www.singh-ray.com/

cheers,

André

radar wrote:Using a screw on ND grad filter will limit your composition as you won't be able to really align your graduation where YOU want it. You will have to align it where the manufacturer wanted to put it.

I use Cokin style ND grad filters using the P-Holder. The filters that I use are from Hitech. http://www.formatt.co.uk/default.aspx

If money is not an issue, then the Singh-Ray filters are the best you can probably get, I'm saving for some of them, have a look at:
http://www.singh-ray.com/

cheers,

André

Is there a screw on all ND filters? I can't say i've really checked.. I'm just wanting something similar to the way a circular polarizer works.. eg. screw it on, and rotate.

B&W filters are known for their very high quality....and painful price.

gleff wrote:Is there a screw on all ND filters? I can't say i've really checked.. I'm just wanting something similar to the way a circular polarizer works.. eg. screw it on, and rotate.

It isn't just the orientation but how high or low in the frame you want the graduation.

gleff wrote:[
Is there a screw on all ND filters? I can't say i've really checked.. I'm just wanting something similar to the way a circular polarizer works.. eg. screw it on, and rotate.

What do you actually want to do with the the filter?

An ND filter is typically a screw on filter. You would use it to slow down your shutter speed, eg on a waterfall or moving water, so to get that silky smooth water. The density of the filter is the same throughout.

A graduated ND filter will go from a dark half to a clear half. You typically use this for something like a sunrise. You would align the line that goes from darker to clear with the horizon. Go to the Singh-Ray site and look at the Galen Rowell grad ND. These filters give you a more even exposure throughout the photo so the darker foreground elements are properly exposed and the brighter sky is also properly exposed.

I'm just not sure if you are after a graduated filter or not

HTH,

André

and here is a link to the B&W line of Neutral Density filters:
http://www.schneideroptics.com/ecommerce/CatalogSubCategoryDisplay.aspx?CID=679

radar wrote:

gleff wrote:[
Is there a screw on all ND filters? I can't say i've really checked.. I'm just wanting something similar to the way a circular polarizer works.. eg. screw it on, and rotate.

What do you actually want to do with the the filter?

I'm just not sure if you are after a graduated filter or not

HTH,

André

I want to use it for sunrises, sunsets, landscape photography and the like. The intention is to have half and half so I'm assuming the graduated is what I want. I'll check out the links.. thanks.

I recently bought a set of Cokins.

It's called the P Series to fit larger lenses. You will need the holder which attaches to the lens, and then you will need the actual filters. I bought a 3 stop GND for sunsets and x 2 stop ND to stack with the GND or use alone for waterfalls and beaches etc...

Cost me about $100 AUD for the three landed from Adorama.

Geoff,

gleff wrote:[
I want to use it for sunrises, sunsets, landscape photography and the like. The intention is to have half and half so I'm assuming the graduated is what I want. I'll check out the links.. thanks.

Then you really want the filters that fit the P-series Cokin holder. You have a wide selection, as methd says, he got the Cokin holder and Cokin filters. I got the Cokin holder and the Hitech filters. Others here, as in glamy, use the Singh-Ray filters, the ultimate in the grad ND filters. They also fit in the Cokin holder.

The P-series type of filters give you the most flexibility in terms of alignment and as methd mentions, you can also stack the filters depending on the effect you want.

Cheers,

André

radar wrote:Geoff,

gleff wrote:[
I want to use it for sunrises, sunsets, landscape photography and the like. The intention is to have half and half so I'm assuming the graduated is what I want. I'll check out the links.. thanks.

Then you really want the filters that fit the P-series Cokin holder. You have a wide selection, as methd says, he got the Cokin holder and Cokin filters. I got the Cokin holder and the Hitech filters. Others here, as in glamy, use the Singh-Ray filters, the ultimate in the grad ND filters. They also fit in the Cokin holder.

The P-series type of filters give you the most flexibility in terms of alignment and as methd mentions, you can also stack the filters depending on the effect you want.

Cheers,

André

Is this what I would need?

http://www.adorama.com/CKBPP.html?searc ... item_no=23 <- P Series Holder
http://www.adorama.com/CK77P.html <- 77mm Lens adaptor ring

And then just get the filters themselves from any of the manufacturers eg. hitech, singh-ray, cokin etc?

gleff wrote:
Is this what I would need?

http://www.adorama.com/CKBPP.html?searc ... item_no=23 <- P Series Holder
http://www.adorama.com/CK77P.html <- 77mm Lens adaptor ring

And then just get the filters themselves from any of the manufacturers eg. hitech, singh-ray, cokin etc?

That's correct, that's what I use on my Tokina 12-24. I get vignetting at 12mm but it is gone by 14mm. You have the Sigma 10-20, not sure how that will go in terms of vignetting. You will probably get some at the wide end but I have read in the past that the Sigma is less prone to vignetting then the Tokina, so YMMV.

If you want to be sure that you won't get vignetting, you probably need to go to the Cokin Z-Pro but then the filters get even more expensive.

Cheers,

André

radar wrote:

gleff wrote:
Is this what I would need?

http://www.adorama.com/CKBPP.html?searc ... item_no=23 <- P Series Holder
http://www.adorama.com/CK77P.html <- 77mm Lens adaptor ring

And then just get the filters themselves from any of the manufacturers eg. hitech, singh-ray, cokin etc?

That's correct, that's what I use on my Tokina 12-24. I get vignetting at 12mm but it is gone by 14mm. You have the Sigma 10-20, not sure how that will go in terms of vignetting. You will probably get some at the wide end but I have read in the past that the Sigma is less prone to vignetting then the Tokina, so YMMV.

If you want to be sure that you won't get vignetting, you probably need to go to the Cokin Z-Pro but then the filters get even more expensive.

Cheers,

André

I'm not really concerned about the price so much.. I have 10 grand worth of equipment as it is.. what's another 200-300 bucks

Thanks for the help.

Hi Geoff,

Have a look at this thread from November http://www.dslrusers.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=29666&sid=5a479472096f1ae1ed1ba342fa0e84cd.

If money is no object and your going to do landscape photography with a wide angle lens then purchase the Z-Pro holder and wider filters as it will accommodate the 10mm end of the lens.

Cheers

Wocka wrote:Hi Geoff,

Have a look at this thread from November http://www.dslrusers.net/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=29666&sid=5a479472096f1ae1ed1ba342fa0e84cd.

If money is no object and your going to do landscape photography with a wide angle lens then purchase the Z-Pro holder and wider filters as it will accommodate the 10mm end of the lens.

Cheers

That is what you need for your 10-20.
As Radar mentioned I have the Singh Ray brand and am very happy with their products and service. I switched from Cokin when I had the opportunity to compare side by side. The Cokin altered the colors more than the Singh Ray. It is a matter of personal opinion, but like in anything else be prepared to spend more than planned. I now have 5 graduated filters and sometimes would like some more . By the way the P size Cokin are 100mm long, the Singh Ray are 120mm long which allows for more adjustments.
Cheers,
Gerard

Does Maxwell at Lidcombe have a shop and sell to the public? I'd really like to pick up the filters today but I don't know where to get them. I can't see the smaller shops having them in stock.

I've decided to go the Z-Pro series. I'm still reluctant to buy this sight unseen because of the confusing nature of the kits, different holders, and filter models. I'd like to go into a shop, attach it, and see for myself.

Only then will I feel comfortable forking out the money for filters etc.

If Maxwell doesn't sell to the public in a shop, can anyone recommend a good shop in Sydney I can drop into today and pick something up. One that would likely have something? Eg. perhaps a pro shop of sorts. I would like expert advice as I look at it. Not the Teds,or Paxtons kind of service.

I really want to have something by the weekend

gleff wrote:If Maxwell doesn't sell to the public in a shop, can anyone recommend a good shop in Sydney I can drop into today and pick something up. One that would likely have something? Eg. perhaps a pro shop of sorts. I would like expert advice as I look at it. Not the Teds,or Paxtons kind of service.

I initially got my Cokin filter holder at Vanbar, they are in Camperdown, easy to get to: http://www.vanbar.com.au/

Or try ECS at http://www.cameras.net.au/

Give either a call first to see if they have stock,

cheers,

Andre

radar wrote:

gleff wrote:If Maxwell doesn't sell to the public in a shop, can anyone recommend a good shop in Sydney I can drop into today and pick something up. One that would likely have something? Eg. perhaps a pro shop of sorts. I would like expert advice as I look at it. Not the Teds,or Paxtons kind of service.

I initially got my Cokin filter holder at Vanbar, they are in Camperdown, easy to get to: http://www.vanbar.com.au/

Or try ECS at http://www.cameras.net.au/

Give either a call first to see if they have stock,

cheers,

Andre

Thanks Andre,

I might try Vanbar as I've been there before.. I just couldn't remember their name. I found the fellow really helpful last time as he had no quelms about spending heaps of time with me while I made a decision.

Cheers
Geoff

Ok.. I was just looking a little closer at what to get. Does this sound like it would do the trick at least to start off with for doing landscape stuff with my 10-20mm Sigma?

1. FCZ-477 Cokin ZPro 77m filter adapter

2. FCZ-U961 Cokin ZPro Grad Holder,Z121L,Z123L,Z125L

The price would be about $255 total. I can always get other filters later. My biggest concern is whether this Grad Holder will work with my Sigma lens without vignetting. I've heard about a wide angle holder.. not sure what that is though.

Alrighty then.. I bit the bullet and went to Vanbar in Camperdown. As usual they were very helpful however they didn't have any Z-Pro series in stock. Apparently they're not that popular so they order them in special. They did however have the P-Series in stock with the Wide angle Holder. They also didn't have the ND4 in stock so I ended up buying the Wide angle holder for the P Series, the 77mm generic brand adaptor ring, and the ND2, and ND8 Grad ND filters. All up $100.40

My biggest concern was using it on the Sigma 10-20mm lens. Would I suffer from massive Vignetting etc.

Well.. Just got home and took a couple of shots from my veranda to test it, and i'm very pleased. At 10mm I get a tiny bit of vignetting (not a huge amount).. in fact, the vignetting is gone by around 11mm. This is wile I already have a Hoya skylight filter already screwed on the lens. If I take the skylight off, and screw on the Hoya CP lens, then add the Cokin filter on top of that, the vignetting disappears at 12mm.

I can live with 1-2mm of vignetting. In fact, i'm rather pleased that I saved loads of money by going the P-Series. Now I can expand my P-series filters without spending a fortune.. In fact, the first thing I'll do is get the ND4.

Thanks to everyone that assisted.. Especially Andre. One Happy Jan....errrr. Geoff

gleff wrote:My biggest concern is whether this Grad Holder will work with my Sigma lens without vignetting. I've heard about a wide angle holder.. not sure what that is though.

The Z-Pro series is wider then the P holder so it should help in reducing or eliminating vignetting at the 10mm end for your Sigma lens. Since you are going to a physical shop, take your lens and camera with you. I'm sure they'll let you try before you buy.

The wide angle holder has a lower profile and can only take one filter. The standard holder can take up to three filters so you can stack them for different effects. Since the WA holder is not as thick, it works better with WA lenses in reducing vignetting. If you are getting the Z-pro system, you don't have to worry as it can be assembled in different ways for WA lenses, see http://www.cokin.fr/ico15/ico15-haut.html?=#z

Stacking of filters can be useful depending on the conditions. I have the WA holder myself and will eventually get the standard one when I get around to it.

HTH

André