Sydney harbour bridge

[Technik]

I just bought a D70s with kit lens last week. Below is a photo that I took at the Rocks tonight. I'd appreciate your comments



Exposure Mode: Shutter Priority
1.30 sec - F/5.6
Exposure Comp.: +0.3 EV
Sensitivity: ISO 200
White Balance: Auto -1
AF Mode: AF-S

Cheers

[birddog114]

Good to see your first capture one of the Sydney post card!

You definitely need a tripod and head to shoot this without blurring and softness.
The more practices you put on, the more achievement you'll gain.

[Alpha_7]

Glad to see your out and about with the new camera, I still haven't managed to get to the rocks after dark, but it is on my list.

As Birdy suggested, when it comes down to night shooting the kit lens is great, but the tripod is the all important factor. I find shooting at f8 delivers sharp gorgeous nightscapes, but without a tripod that sharpness isn't going to happen. Tripods also help you frame your shots a little better as you take the time to think and compose (well sometimes).
In this shot I think the sloping horizon and the tops of the fence a little distracting from the rest of the scene. Another tip with this time of shot is to bracket your exposure, either use the incamera bracketing or do it manually by shooting in Manual mode, this helps reduce blown highlights and you can blend in shots in Post processing (but again the camera can't move so you need the tripod).

[nito]

Nice shot, but I do agree with birddog and alpha on all points. However, instead of removing the fence in the re-frame I would suggest take a step back to include more of the fence with a sloping horizon.

[Alex]

Well done. Nice image. Agree with others on tripod.

Alex

[gstark]

Hi Technik,

I think you've fallen for one of the most common traps in taking this image, which is almost great.

But you've failed to look in the viewfinder and examine each of the elements that you're capturing.

For instance, where is the southern pylon from the bridge? It was certainly there this afternoon, both times, when I drove across it. But it's absent in your image.

It's almost always worth taking that extra two seconds to let your eye scan the viewfinder and examine the image elements- should I show both ends of the bridge?, for instance. Clearly, the wide angle of the lens, and your location, should not be preventing this.

In people shots, a similar approach needs to be taken - why is there a tree sprouting forth from Aunt Mabel's head? If she was born that way, fine. Otherwise, a half step to the left will probably provide some instant relief.

But great work. Keep shooting, and remember that unless you're shooting, you're not going to get the chance to improve. Keep posting, please.

[marcotrov]

As birddog suggest Technik. I'm also not sure whether moving closer to get rid of all the points of the wrought iron fence form leaking into the bottom edge of the frame or move back to include a little more of the fence as foreground interest may have made a difference. Nice shot all the same
cheers
marco

[Technik]

Thanks for all the feedback/comments everyone. As a matter of fact, I did take this night shot with a tripod, however I probably shaked the camera a little whilst I pressed the shooting button. Setting an automatic timer with a wireless remote should fix the problem.

As Alpha_7 has pointed out, I should have taken the picture at a narrower aperture. Shooting at F8/11 would make the image sharper without the blurring and softness.

I'd definitely pay attention of the finer details next time (eg. the fence and the southern pylon.) I won't forget

All in all, I'm glad to know all the mistakes I have made.

[Alpha_7]

Technik,

I don't want to read to much into your last post, but please don't take our comments and suggest too personally. Sometimes it can be tough to hear about the mistakes or short coming in a shot, sometimes as the photographer we don't see them ourselves, this forum provides a great resource with many talented and knowledgable people that can help you improve your shots. I've definitely found it a great help since joining, but sometimes you need a tough skin when posting in the critique section.

Overall it does seem like you've taken a lot of positives out of the post, tripod (timer or remote shutter release) f8-f11 and as Gary said frame it and check the viewfinder something I fail to do on a regular basis.

[Technik]

yes, definitely. I found this is a great forum since I joined last year, heaps of valuable resources and information. Please don't take it the wrong way, I appreciate all the feedbacks and comments as I still got so much to learn from everyone!

Practice makes prefect

[Alpha_7]

yes, definitely. I found this is a great forum since I joined last year, heaps of valuable resources and information. Please don't take it the wrong way, I appreciate all the feedbacks and comments as I still got so much to learn from everyone!

Practice makes prefect

No worries, I just didn't want you getting the wrong impression, or depressed about the feedback. I look forward to seeing more shots from you!

And Practice makes perfect, or close enough.

[gstark]

Thanks for all the feedback/comments everyone. As a matter of fact, I did take this night shot with a tripod, however I probably shaked the camera a little whilst I pressed the shooting button. Setting an automatic timer with a wireless remote should fix the problem.

Using the self-timer should be enough, although the Nikon remote is hardly an expensive item to purchase. Just remember to also use your eyepiece blind. It's a little piece of black plastic that would have fallen out of your box as you unpacked the camera.

It's purpose is to close off the viewfinder during tripod-mounted shots so that stray light is prevented from entering through the viewfinder and affecting your exposure settings before you actually make the exposure.

Using the primary shutter release whilst the camera is mounted on a tripod is something that should best be avoided, for exactly the reasons you've mentioned.

All in all, I'm glad to know all the mistakes I have made.

Ahhh ... but we've not told you about all of them.

[Alpha_7]

Gary this might be a little OT, but on subject of the viewfinder blind (I just found my 2 days ago wrapped in plastic still). Infact I wasn't even aware of the topic till on the same day Doug mentioned it, I saw a post on the forum. Anyways does it only affect the metering before the shot is taken, or does it actually affect the shot it's self.

When Doug mentioned it I immediately did a crude test by shining my torch righ down the viewfinder to see if I affected the shot. I was unable to notice the difference so have continued not to use the blind, but now I know where it is again, should I make it common pratice to put it on for tripod mounted night shooting ?

[Potatis]

I remember that test, Craig. There we were in dim light with me telling you to cover your viewfinder, and you go and shine your torch into it for the whole long exposure. Didn't seem to make the slightest shred of difference in the end. Interesting test.

[sirhc55]

The simple answer is that in Manual mode it does not matter about covering the eyepiece. In all other modes you should. I believe the reasoning is that the mirror in a DSLR is semi transparent and in auto modes any light entering through the viewfinder will affect exposure

[Alpha_7]

The simple answer is that in Manual mode it does not matter about covering the eyepiece. In all other modes you should. I believe the reasoning is that the mirror in a DSLR is semi transparent and in auto modes any light entering through the viewfinder will affect exposure

OK so it affects the metering before the shot is taken, not the actual expsosure while the shutters open. I might test this further next night shoot - Thanks

[MCWB]

Chris, surely the light meter acts the same for all metering modes? Just as stray light entering the viewfinder under a non-manual mode will cause the meter to think there's more light than there really is and hence to underexpose the image, the '0' exposure mark on the manual scale would actually reflect underexposure.

[sirhc55]

OK so it affects the metering before the shot is taken, not the actual expsosure while the shutters open. I might test this further next night shoot - Thanks

Actually, no. It affects the shot during exposure (or can). If shooting manual you have set the parameters for the shot and they are fixed. Very much the same as manual focussing.

If shooting in A, S or P modes there is a chance of stray light through the viewfinder affecting the exposure.

[sirhc55]

Chris, surely the light meter acts the same for all metering modes? Just as stray light entering the viewfinder under a non-manual mode will cause the meter to think there's more light than there really is and hence to underexpose the image, the '0' exposure mark on the manual scale would actually reflect underexposure.

No Trent - whilst during exposure in manual mode all functions of exposure are ’locked off’ when you release the shutter. You have already set the criteria for the shot - that’s why it is called manual - you are in control, not the camera

[gstark]

Trent, Craig,

Chriss has summed this up rather well. If you're in a manual metering mode, then you have set the shutter and aperture values that are in use. The meter may still be affected, but that's not what's setting the exposure: you are.

In the auto-exposure modes, the meter reads the light and then sets the exposure according to the light values it's "seeing", and if there's light entering via the viewfinder and hitting the metering sensors, then your exposure - as being (automatically) set by the metering system - may well be affected.

[MCWB]

Chris, I would have thought that in any mode, once the shutter was released the exposure parameters (aperture, shutter speed, ISO) were locked in. Say I'm in A mode, taking a night pic of a building and 'correct' exposure when I trip the shutter, as per the meter, is ISO200, 10 s, f/8. What happens if there's a blackout in the middle of my exposure and all the lights in the building go out? Surely I'll get a 10 s exposure that's underexposed, not a 20-30 s exposure that's correct?

I'd have thought that stray light before the shutter is tripped would be the problem, as it affects what the meter thinks is 'correct' exposure?

Gary: sure, but if you're relying on the meter to give you an idea of the exposure settings you should be using, it'll still be out?

To both Gary and Chris: I agree that if you just dial in your settings in manual mode and disregard the meter, you'll get the exposure you intended (whether correct or not).

[Sheila Smart]

I took a similar shot (but from the other side) - here is the EXIF from my shot
Full EXIF Info
Date/Time 20-Mar-2004 23:05:07
Make Canon
Model EOS D60
Flash Used No
Focal Length 17 mm
Exposure Time 30.00 sec
Aperture f/22
ISO Equivalent 800
Exposure Bias
White Balance (-1)
Metering Mode matrix (5)
JPEG Quality (6)
Exposure Program
Focus Distance
when I had my Canon D60. I won't post the shot as I don't crash in on someone else's wave! Although my exposure was the same as yours, the aperture was very much different as was the ISO. As others have said, bracket the shot and if you have PSCS2 you can merge them to make a higher definition image. Don't ask me how this is done as I have yet to try it! But I am told you should change the shutter speed and not the aperture to use this in PS.

Cheers
Sheila

[Alpha_7]

Chris, I would have thought that in any mode, once the shutter was released the exposure parameters (aperture, shutter speed, ISO) were locked in. Say I'm in A mode, taking a night pic of a building and 'correct' exposure when I trip the shutter, as per the meter, is ISO200, 10 s, f/8. What happens if there's a blackout in the middle of my exposure and all the lights in the building go out? Surely I'll get a 10 s exposure that's underexposed, not a 20-30 s exposure that's correct?

I'd have thought that stray light before the shutter is tripped would be the problem, as it affects what the meter thinks is 'correct' exposure?

Gary: sure, but if you're relying on the meter to give you an idea of the exposure settings you should be using, it'll still be out?

To both Gary and Chris: I agree that if you just dial in your settings in manual mode and disregard the meter, you'll get the exposure you intended (whether correct or not).

Trent more eloquently said what I'd been thinking, and trying to say.

[gstark]

Trent,

I'd have thought that stray light before the shutter is tripped would be the problem, as it affects what the meter thinks is 'correct' exposure?

This depends upon the camera and the metering modes available and employed.

For instance, what you're saying is absolutely true wrt my FE2: it has no capability of metering during the exposure, and thus the meter parameters are set immediately prior to the shutter being opened.

In the 801 however, the metering sysem is more advanced, and thus the camera meters during exposure in certain metering modes. Consequently, light value changes during the exposure can have an effect on the actual exposure.

Similarly, the D70 can meter during the exposure, and also during a flash exposure, although during a flash exposure the metering system also, where it can, controls the flash output, setting the shutter and aperture values prior to the making of the exposure and turning off the strobe's output when it deems that enough light has fallen on the subject.

Gary: sure, but if you're relying on the meter to give you an idea of the exposure settings you should be using, it'll still be out?

Highly likely.

And I've yet to see any discussion of reciprocity failure as it affects digital photography. Sure, we have increased noise in cameras line the D70, and we also see colour casting occurring due to the sensorheating up on longer exposures, but is this the same as reciprocity failure?

I honestly don't know.

[MCWB]

Gary,

This camera is evidently more intelligent than me. Looks like I have some more experimenting to do, thanks for the explanation.

[sirhc55]

Gary - reciprocity failure is only applicable to film. The digital world is totally different and as you have said, we can get sensor overheating plus noise with cameras such as the D70 et al.

Personally I hate the definition ”Digital Film” it’s no such thing and is only advertising verbage for the masses so they can understand what a CF, SD, etc., applies to, with retro thinking.

[sirhc55]

Trent - many people forget where the 1005 cell CCD is located for metering. It’s located in the viewfinder - hence the covering of the eyepiece for long exposures. When using the camera normally the eye would tend to cover the eyepiece enough to prevent problems.