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Another Sydney location that has been seriously reamed by photographers, I think you are almost guaranteed to see a amateur photographer at this beach on any given day. Well anyway it was my turn to be one of those (well it was me and Cameron)

We did not stay too long and after a full night shift I was struggling, the first image is one I like but am at odds on how to crop it, I want to go with the standard thirds option but am loathed to remove any of the clouds, thoughts?



Dynamic range, i have a option to use a number of bracketed images to get more range, however this image really gave me a sense of scene at the time, note this was me huddled under a rock while Cameron was out in the pouring rain capturing the great water movement and sun



Cliche images of turimetta, i could not think of anything else to give them somethign extra that would push them above the norm. Critique more than welcome.

It is very hard to pick which is the best
image. They are all very good in composition
colour movement and perspective.

I like the first (and that rush of brown (sand?) at the bottom is different/unusual/interesting). I get the feeling of ever so slightly falling to the right with the horizon. I think you could crop the top and still be OK (the twinkle of blue at the top is nice tho - but perhaps not enough)

#3 is probably my fave - although the headland on the left has gone really black (grad) so I wish it had more life and detail in it.

Hi Gerry, these have your stamp on them in-terms of style and up to your usual quality.

As I am a proponent of the clouds and sun theory, I will be succint in critiquing your vernacular carcass.

#1 It's got a few nice elements but needs another to anchor the viewer and make them go wow.
#2 The big rock and the sun compete a little and I find the you've controlled the flare quite nicely though. In that sense, the big rock breaks the flow of this picture I reckon. Is this a manual exposure stack? The big rock has a tarnished upper side due to the filter but you will only see it if you scrutinise too much.
#3 Very nice and a few elements to boot and color is one of them. I reckon try to back off on the midtone contrast in the near waves to let it smooth out a little. The general tones/textures seem softer in this picture so the waves clash a little.
#4 needs another element despite the foreground waves being quite strong.

My order of preference goes 1, 4, 3, 2.

#1 Like the water I feel number one is sucking me into it. I agree a little that another point of interest might make it stronger (like a piece of diftwood or a large shell on the sand) but given the long exposure I'd guess that might be trick.. unless u had a big HEAVY rock that wasn't going to move around.

#2 As is this shot feels unbalanced, and I'd try a square crop of the RHS including the big rock, but cutting out the headland on the left handside. The rocks then make a semicircle around the sunrise and that's appealing to me somehow.

#3 Hard to describe but I think it's missing something, I like how the gutter is so turburlent and leads you out to the sunrise. I think the headland and the dark cloud in the LHS feel a bit flat to me. I'd love a old fisherman in a raincoat out on the RHS rock shelf with a long beach rod.. but I guess you didn't bring one of those along with you


#4 I really dig the sense of movement you've captured here. I might be temped to crop a little off the LHS side.. but not much.


1 and 2 - I agree a little (but only a little) that another point of interest in the foreground might make for stronger composition - (like a piece of diftwood or a large shell on the sand) but given the long exposure I'd guess that might be tricky.. unless u had a big HEAVY rock that wasn't going to move around.

I wouldn't mind seeing #1 in BW, with the sky poked and prodded a bit to bring out more detail

Great shots. Is that what Gary said I'm supposed to say? Maybe I need to go back and read that post again.

I think the weaknesses of #1 to #3 are the holes in the clouds. Next time take some duct tape with you and fix them up before the photograph. #4 doesn't have that problem and focuses you right into the image. I think the foreground water in that image (#4) may benefit from more darkness and light, so an increase of some combination of contrast, clarity, microcontrast, vibrance. Perhaps even a black border would help.

#1 I think has great potential but is not there yet. The water rushing out looks great. It's more coherent if you crop it down but it also becomes more unbalanced and doesn't work as well. So I think you need to experminent with darkening the bright patch in the sky while retaining a sense of realism. The blue is probably OK as long as you can make the white bits grey. Perhaps consider replacing that as well. And I think the foreground could be a touch brighter.

#2 has the same problem with the bright sky at the top. Making that darker and I think cropping down a touch will lift that image hugely. Possibly a touch more contrast as well, though not too much.

#3 has the same problem with holes in the sky that your mind can fall through. (And then it might be difficult to find it again. You need to have a good hold on your mind when viewing these images.) Cropping it down almost works. (The image, not your mind. Though that may apply as well.) I don't think this image integrates as well as the others. To me there are about three different images in there that don't quite meld together - a panorama around the horizon, the central rocks and the foreground seaweed and rocks. I think there's a bit more going on in the foreground that may have been cut off a touch too abruptly. I suspect a slightly lower angle and a little bit more of the foreground may have worked better.

It has all been said, but I will add 2c worth on #2. I think the three elements of the headland, rock and sun balance the picture and the darker top of the rock from the grad filter (if there was one) looks like natural discolouration.
ps Great shots.

Gerry, what can I say? Great stuff even with the sheepish hiding from the rain.

sheesh, there is some great feedback here, thanks a million, when i get some more time I will revisit this and respond, standby.

Print and sell....fine art.

biggerry wrote:thanks a million

I've PMed my address for you to send the cheque....

biggerry wrote:... when i get some more time I will revisit this and respond, standby.

I've been standing by the computer for a while now. Nothing much seems to happen.

Murray Foote wrote:

biggerry wrote:... when i get some more time I will revisit this and respond, standby.

I've been standing by the computer for a while now. Nothing much seems to happen.

Don't take it too literally, you may sit down

Cheers
Steffen.

Steffen wrote:

Murray Foote wrote:

biggerry wrote:... when i get some more time I will revisit this and respond, standby.

I've been standing by the computer for a while now. Nothing much seems to happen.

Don't take it too literally, you may sit down

Murray Foote wrote:

biggerry wrote:... when i get some more time I will revisit this and respond, standby.

I've been standing by the computer for a while now. Nothing much seems to happen.

man what you smoking down there in the capital?

I have not forgotton about ya'all, especially you Murrary - however in my spare 30 seconds I recropped the first, whilst the darn horizon is still smack in the middle I reckon this locks the viewer in a bit better, thoughts?

Definitely much better.

Nice crop! It's sucking the viewer in much more. Clone that water spot out though.

zafra52 wrote:It is very hard to pick which is the best image. They are all very good in composition colour movement and perspective.

cheers zafra

Remorhaz wrote:I like the first (and that rush of brown (sand?) at the bottom is different/unusual/interesting). I get the feeling of ever so slightly falling to the right with the horizon. I think you could crop the top and still be OK (the twinkle of blue at the top is nice tho - but perhaps not enough)
#3 is probably my fave - although the headland on the left has gone really black (grad) so I wish it had more life and detail in it.

yes you are correct the horizon is a bit off kilter, i do have a few other images similiar to #3 with the headland more expososed however they seem to come across more hdrish and artifical.

The first image has the sand in the water movement - next time i will not worry about gettign wet feet and concetrate on getting a better picture

surenj wrote:Hi Gerry, these have your stamp on them in-terms of style and up to your usual quality.
As I am a proponent of the clouds and sun theory, I will be succint in critiquing your vernacular carcass.

I wish i could shake that style though mmmm vernacular carcass... i like it and i still feel like that now.

surenj wrote:#1 It's got a few nice elements but needs another to anchor the viewer and make them go wow.

yes, i hear ya i was looking for more of a minimalist scene with layers but i certainly don't think it quite got to that point, i think even with the cropped version its still too busy for that concept.

surenj wrote:#2 The big rock and the sun compete a little and I find the you've controlled the flare quite nicely though. In that sense, the big rock breaks the flow of this picture I reckon. Is this a manual exposure stack? The big rock has a tarnished upper side due to the filter but you will only see it if you scrutinise too much.

yeah its a crap image, the rock is in the wrong place and dominates. This is a single exposure image, i have the option of using brackets to create something else but i think the composition does not warrant it.

surenj wrote:#3 Very nice and a few elements to boot and color is one of them. I reckon try to back off on the midtone contrast in the near waves to let it smooth out a little. The general tones/textures seem softer in this picture so the waves clash a little.

ahh yes, its always a hard deceision to choose whether to go smooth or rough (and keep ya minds outta teh gutter chaps). I will look at the option for a smoothie...

here is another version from the same spot as #2, that damn rock still stands out...

Alpha_7 wrote:My order of preference goes 1, 4, 3, 2.
#1 Like the water I feel number one is sucking me into it. I agree a little that another point of interest might make it stronger (like a piece of diftwood or a large shell on the sand) but given the long exposure I'd guess that might be trick.. unless u had a big HEAVY rock that wasn't going to move around.

cheers Craig, i find your order of preference insightful

I agree that the image does need another element in its current form, as mentioned I think it may work as a minimalist layered image however it would certainly need another world of processing.

Alpha_7 wrote:#2 As is this shot feels unbalanced, and I'd try a square crop of the RHS including the big rock, but cutting out the headland on the left handside. The rocks then make a semicircle around the sunrise and that's appealing to me somehow.

yeah, definitely agree see the image posted above, that rock is just too big and dominant i reckon...

Alpha_7 wrote:#4 I really dig the sense of movement you've captured here. I might be temped to crop a little off the LHS side.. but not much.

good point, this would also centre the channel in the frame.

Murray Foote wrote:I think the weaknesses of #1 to #3 are the holes in the clouds. Next time take some duct tape with you and fix them up before the photograph. #4 doesn't have that problem and focuses you right into the image.

I guess your saying the breaks in teh cloud draw the attention away from the main subjects? hopefully in that portrait crop the break helps the image and adds to it.

Murray Foote wrote:I think the foreground water in that image (#4) may benefit from more darkness and light, so an increase of some combination of contrast, clarity, microcontrast, vibrance. Perhaps even a black border would help.

more darkness and light ehh? with the overal result being darker or brighter? Unfortunately I do not do borders at this point in time, i think they are a waste of space in every sense (i do reserved the right to change my opinion in the future though )

Murray Foote wrote:#1 I think has great potential but is not there yet. The water rushing out looks great. It's more coherent if you crop it down but it also becomes more unbalanced and doesn't work as well. So I think you need to experminent with darkening the bright patch in the sky while retaining a sense of realism. The blue is probably OK as long as you can make the white bits grey. Perhaps consider replacing that as well. And I think the foreground could be a touch brighter.

hopefully the portrait crop addresses some of those issues...

Murray Foote wrote:#2 has the same problem with the bright sky at the top. Making that darker and I think cropping down a touch will lift that image hugely. Possibly a touch more contrast as well, though not too much.

see the second version of this image, and i think your right reframing/cropping is definitely required.

Murray Foote wrote:#3 has the same problem with holes in the sky that your mind can fall through. (And then it might be difficult to find it again. You need to have a good hold on your mind when viewing these images.) Cropping it down almost works. (The image, not your mind. Though that may apply as well.) I don't think this image integrates as well as the others. To me there are about three different images in there that don't quite meld together - a panorama around the horizon, the central rocks and the foreground seaweed and rocks. I think there's a bit more going on in the foreground that may have been cut off a touch too abruptly. I suspect a slightly lower angle and a little bit more of the foreground may have worked better.

ahh, yes more on teh bottom, yes I agree and in my defence it was hard to pick the right amount to give in teh FG to capture the incoming wave.

cropping my mind, i think i did that at uni, more than once.....mind falling through holes i like the sound of that, where can i get some?

cheers for the critique Murray, very helpful.

CraigVTR wrote:It has all been said, but I will add 2c worth on #2. I think the three elements of the headland, rock and sun balance the picture and the darker top of the rock from the grad filter (if there was one) looks like natural discolouration.
ps Great shots.

cheers craig.

aim54x wrote:Gerry, what can I say? Great stuff even with the sheepish hiding from the rain.

i liked your one with the sunrise and the channel better

surenj wrote:I've PMed my address for you to send the cheque....

its in the mail...truly it is..no really, i swear i posted it...

Murray Foote wrote:I've been standing by the computer for a while now. Nothing much seems to happen.

thats life...

biggerry wrote:

Murray Foote wrote:I think the foreground water in that image (#4) may benefit from more darkness and light, so an increase of some combination of contrast, clarity, microcontrast, vibrance. Perhaps even a black border would help.

more darkness and light ehh? with the overal result being darker or brighter? Unfortunately I do not do borders at this point in time, i think they are a waste of space in every sense (i do reserved the right to change my opinion in the future though )

More darkness and light in the sense of more contrast in the water, then assess overall levels if necessary.

I don't do borders either. The reason I suggested is that I thought the picture might look better on a black background, rather than the light cyan default for the site. With lights out in Lightroom, for example. This is due to the bottom half of the image being quite light at the edges. So if I'm right about that, it might help the image to have a moderately thick black border.

Murray Foote wrote:So if I'm right about that, it might help the image to have a moderately thick black border.

fair call.

just for giggles here is another edited version - i think this has pushed past the overcooked line for me.

I think it works a lot better than the earlier version.

I think the main thing that's overcooked is the contrast in the rocks. The sky probably doesn't need to be quite so black either.