DSLRUsers.com

G'day

This is just to show that even the best of suppliers can have an off day. (But why do the wait for me?)

I had a planned model shoot for early September and I decided a nice cheap radio trigger was the way to go. I know using mail order with only a three week window between ordering and planned use is 'optomistic', I thought I'd give it a go, after all I had plenty of fallback options if necessary. Recognising such small orders are probably more work that they're worth to HKS, I decided to add a few flash diffusers to at least make the order a little bigger.

Anyway, this is my tail of woe.

16/08 - Goods ordered from DSLRUsers web site and payment made email sent
18/08 - Payment made email sent from Gary to HKS and cc me
26/08 - Email advice from Gary that goods were dispatched
08/09 - Email to Gary that goods not yet received
08/09 - Enquiries made to Aust post re tracking number, they have no knowlege
15/09 - Further email to Gary that goods not received
19/09 - Aust post still denying any knowlege of parcel with the tracking no advised by HKS
19/09 - Gary advises HKS that the parcel is missing
23/09 - Aust post confirmed they recieved parcel 1/9 but returned to sender for 'reasons unknown'
01/10 - Gary asks for my bank accont details for refund
10/10 - Gary advised bank details
14/10 - Advised the parcel was returned to Hong Kong, marked "Left Address/Unknown" but the address was my correct current address
01/11 - Still no sign of the refund.

Now I've had some great service from Poon and HKS and some so-so service, but this example is definately poor. It must be made clear, Australia Post has clearly been partially at fault here, but I don't think the Aust Post is the only poor service.

I suspect that I would have been better served if I hadn't used my PO Box as the delivery address, I used it however because I saw no reason to spend a day at home awaiting delivery of trinkets.

While all this was going on, I had the following order as well
Sun 14/9 - Phottix grip ordered from website
Wed 17/9 - Email advice that goods were dispatched
Mon 22/9 - Goods arrived at my PO box

What more could one ask for?

BullcreekBob wrote:10/10 - Gary advised bank details
14/10 - Advised the parcel was returned to Hong Kong, marked "Left Address/Unknown" but the address was my correct current address
01/11 - Still no sign of the refund.

Unless people tell me that they haven't received their refunds, there is no way that I can follow this sort of thing up: I have no access to your bank account, nor to Poon's, and thus I need your timely input in order to follow-up the non-payment of a refund.

The rest of this story is entirely down to the continued incompetence, intransigence, and just plain stupidity of Oz Post.

The only deliveries that we have any issues with at all are those where Oz Post are involved, and in every case, the issue has come back to some stupid excuse such as this, where correct details have been given, but they haven't been able to figure out that the address is indeed within their realm.

I wish that we didn't have to deal with oz Post, but that is something that's outside of our control.

Now I've had some great service from Poon and HKS and some so-so service, but this example is definately poor. It must be made clear, Australia Post has clearly been partially at fault here, but I don't think the Aust Post is the only poor service.

I would respectfully suggest that they're the primary culprit, and they're a long way in front of anyone else.

I agree that it's not good that the refund has not yet been made, and I am - now that I'm aware of this - following this up with Poon.

I had a similar problem. I wanted to get a Canon 15mm 2.8 fisheye lens and checked their website for the price. Once I knew the amount I did a Paypal transfer for that and put all my contact details. I then got an email back saying that the price on the website was incorrect and it was actually some $80 more. I'd try and find the exact amount but its after midnight and I'm knackered. I then sent the second amount and thought everything would be hunky dory.

I then get an email saying that they cannot send the lens to the address I have given them. Because all of us work there is never anyone at home to take delivery. I thus have all my Ebay, Paypal and other internet purchases sent to my company's P.O. Box. I have never, ever lost anything this way but have had a couple of parcels over the years delivered to my house that have gone missing. Amazingly there was no way that they were going to send it to the PO Box even though they already had my money (both lots) in their claw.

I have purchased a good deal of camera equipment from the USA that was sent to my post box but they didn't want to know about. Despite my frustrations and a number of emails they said they would refund my money instead ( I am still shaking my head in disbelief at that). Only thing was they only refunded my initial amount and the "top up" amount was never refunded. Despite a number of emails to the same person nothing ever came of it and I just wrote the whole thing off as a bad experience.

Dipstix Pix wrote:I had a similar problem. I wanted to get a Canon 15mm 2.8 fisheye lens and checked their website for the price.

Which is nothing much to with what's under discussion here. Sorry.

If you check the FAQ, you would understand that we have a special arrangement with HKS, with special pricing and generally very good service. The orders that Bob placed were through that service.

As I administer this site, and that service, I consider that any problems with that service also reflect upon me. Further, because of the very close relationship that we have with Poon - he's a personal friend of many here - I know that he also takes this sort of a reduction in service personally.

While I welcome discussions on issues with respect to direct purchases made from HKS, there needs to be drawn a strong distinction between the two classes of transactions.

Once I knew the amount I did a Paypal transfer for that and put all my contact details. I then got an email back saying that the price on the website was incorrect and it was actually some $80 more. I'd try and find the exact amount but its after midnight and I'm knackered. I then sent the second amount and thought everything would be hunky dory.

This can happen. We try to accommodate pricing changes within our site's design, as our prices here are very directly affected by currency fluctuations.

In your case, I might suggest that you may have even been looking at $US pricing, and may not have even realised that. I've seen that happen with visitors to Poon's site - as well as others - a number of times. Whenever visiting any such shopping site on the Internet, you always need to ensure that you are aware of the currency being used by that site. This is a common trap. My recollection of Poon's site is that his default pricing is USD, and there is no option for AU pricing, hence my suggestion for this.

I then get an email saying that they cannot send the lens to the address I have given them. Because all of us work there is never anyone at home to take delivery. I thus have all my Ebay, Paypal and other internet purchases sent to my company's P.O. Box.

You were ordering a lens with a significant value. That would mean that the goods would have been shipped to you via either FedEx or UPS, neither of whom can deliver to a PO box.

Simply not possible.

Either can, and do, deliver to places of business however. I'm not sure I see a problem.

I have never, ever lost anything this way but have had a couple of parcels over the years delivered to my house that have gone missing. Amazingly there was no way that they were going to send it to the PO Box even though they already had my money (both lots) in their claw.

"In their claw"? That is a very disrespectful way for you to be discussing this matter, especially when you look at the facts and apply a little bit of logic to them. I know, from way too numerous occurrences, how readily and quickly they will offer a refund when goods are unable to be supplied.

You seem to have been offered a refund very quickly ...

Yes, things do go wrong. Last year I spent time in his office, with his staff, who were processing well over 300 orders daily. With that volume of processing, some things are absolutely guaranteed to go awry. It's how those issues are addressed that matters.

So, in your case, the question should have become one of once you advised them of a more appropriate delivery address, would you have then received the goods, as described, in good order, and within what time frame? You chose to cancel the order, and thus this will never be known.

I have purchased a good deal of camera equipment from the USA that was sent to my post box

They're not the other traders; what is the relevance of the delivery services that other businesses may use? The deliveries may have been made using USPS, which is the PO, who are the only people to whom PO boxes are accessible. I'm not saying that this was the case, but I do have perhaps more experience than most in many of these issues, and from a number of different perspectives.

You chose, with all due respect, to be a little bit stubborn about this: that is your right, but I will go further and say that there are very few who are more stubborn than I am.

That said, a couple of observations: a tripod or a lighting kit won't fit into a PO box. The post office will not even accept a beauty dish for delivery. There are, quite simply, a number of items that, by definition, can never, ever, be delivered to a PO box. Poon uses a number of different shipping services, and that his a choice that he makes, as a part of his business operations.

As noted above, the use of a PO box as a delivery medium is restricted, by definition. I have no knowledge of the facts of your other purchases, but my experience in these matters suggests scenarios which is what I have described.

It's rarely wise to shoot the messenger. To fully understand the problems you faced, we need all of the facts. You have not provided them, because some of them are not even available to you. yes, I think you shot the messenger, but respectfully, I think that the bullet may have ricocheted via your foot.

Only thing was they only refunded my initial amount and the "top up" amount was never refunded. Despite a number of emails to the same person nothing ever came of it and I just wrote the whole thing off as a bad experience.

That is certainly not acceptable. Had this occurred through the forum facilities I would be able to help you in this matter, as I am with Bob.

Sorry.

gstark wrote:That said, a couple of observations: a tripod or a lighting kit won't fit into a PO box. The post office will not even accept a beauty dish for delivery.

Not so sure about that Gary, I have a P.O. box which is hardly big enough to fit a standard letter but whenever I get a parcel delivered, they leave a card in the box to let me know that there is a parcel waiting for me inside. At times they have been quite big parcels that I could hardly fit in my car.

Bob, just an aside as this is for my own reference in managing customer expectations, what rough date did you start expect the refund?

Glen wrote:Bob, just an aside as this is for my own reference in managing customer expectations, what rough date did you start expect the refund?

A good question. About now is a rough answer.

I know from experience that payments from my Westpac account to other bank accounts takes somewhere from 1 day to 10 working days. All options in between are equally likely. So allowing for the outside time and leaving a few days for them to get around to it, about now seems the right answer. I'm certainly not sweating on the money, it was only a trinket order. The post was just to balance the "I got great response" post that I usually make. I've seen posts on here criticising similar service from other companies and I am just showing that even the best suppliers and best laid plans can go awry.

phillipb wrote:

gstark wrote:That said, a couple of observations: a tripod or a lighting kit won't fit into a PO box. The post office will not even accept a beauty dish for delivery.

Not so sure about that Gary, I have a P.O. box which is hardly big enough to fit a standard letter but whenever I get a parcel delivered, they leave a card in the box to let me know that there is a parcel waiting for me inside. At times they have been quite big parcels that I could hardly fit in my car.

Speaking from experience, Phillip.

The beauty dish is quite light, but bulky. The HKG PO refused to accept it for delivery because of its bulk. They actually sent it back to HKS, who then sent it to me via UPS.

So yes, they will do that for some packages, but only up to a certain size. I think that if you go to your local PO (every time I go there, I certainly get well and truly PO'd) they may even be able to tell you the maximum size they can accept for delivery.

Glen wrote:Bob, just an aside as this is for my own reference in managing customer expectations, what rough date did you start expect the refund?

Normally, refunds from Poon will be processed within 5-7 business days. Sometimes there's a backlog in terms of moving funds between his various bank accounts, as there are daily aggregate limitations imposed by the bank, and if he has already scheduled to move money from x to y for a week in advance, then these things just get queued up.

I certainly regard this as outstanding beyond a reasonable time, but I'm powerless to help when I'm not informed that the money hasn't come through in a timely manner.

gstark wrote:

phillipb wrote:

gstark wrote:That said, a couple of observations: a tripod or a lighting kit won't fit into a PO box. The post office will not even accept a beauty dish for delivery.

Not so sure about that Gary, I have a P.O. box which is hardly big enough to fit a standard letter but whenever I get a parcel delivered, they leave a card in the box to let me know that there is a parcel waiting for me inside. At times they have been quite big parcels that I could hardly fit in my car.

Speaking from experience, Phillip.

The beauty dish is quite light, but bulky. The HKG PO refused to accept it for delivery because of its bulk. They actually sent it back to HKS, who then sent it to me via UPS.

So yes, they will do that for some packages, but only up to a certain size. I think that if you go to your local PO (every time I go there, I certainly get well and truly PO'd) they may even be able to tell you the maximum size they can accept for delivery.

That's the problem with post offices, especially LPOs they are individually owned and each one is free to do what they want within reason. A lot depends on the working relationship you have with them.

phillipb wrote:That's the problem with post offices, especially LPOs they are individually owned and each one is free to do what they want within reason. A lot depends on the working relationship you have with them.

And if they're a bunch of mindless, bumbling, officious, bureaucrats then you're SOL.

Sadly, that seems to be the case with many of the frontline people who are (allegedly) employed by OzPost. Contractors fail to deliver goods. shop staff take forever and a day to deal with customers, and when they do, it's more to serve their own self-interests than to address the needs of the customer, and when it comes to delivering simple items which have been entrusted to them, they cannot even find the damn things.

I think I'd rather have a gelato at the Coogee Bay Hotel.

Thanks Bob, that would have been about my guess, anything from a few days a ago to know, I find international deposits seem to show up in between 3 to 10 days (I assumed the start date from when Poon got back the items 2 weeks ago).

You sure have had the run around from Australia Post, very frustrating. It really puts a purchaser between a rock and a hard place. If you use something like Fedex for the small stuff you eat up any savings and using Auspost you take a risk on service levels. That said for all the knocking of them, they do provide a timely Australia wide service. I have had a number of hiccups with them recently but really no one offers such an expansive service with so few clients over such a large area.