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I see that Pretec have slashed their 12Gb CF card from $9,999US to $4,999US

Shouldn't this be in the bargains section?

Is there a discount if we buy one each?

I'll buy 3.

How many shots would I get from my Casio using JPEG low or would this be a overkill

DEFINATELY not overkill. I'll let you do the maths though...

LOZ wrote:How many shots would I get from my Casio using JPEG low or would this be a overkill

hehehehe! It may not fit into your Casio or Your Casio may not read it at 12Gb capacity.

Dam it so what do I spend my tax return on

LOZ wrote:Dam it so what do I spend my tax return on

A dishwasher A new capucinno machine

Heath I did the maths and it is about 200hours in vidio mode without sound

You could get 6 x 2 MB card for, what, under AUD1,000

I just don't understand.

Greg B wrote:You could get 6 x 2 MB card for, what, under AUD1,000

I just don't understand.

Yes, you're right!
But the 12Gb card is for the astronauts who're going into the space with a long due to return.

Of course, I'd forgotten the astronauts.

Plus going through a time warp stretches the 12Gb capacity to the power of infinity, which, in turn means that the whole history of the universe can be stored on one 12Gb. Then discreetly hidden in a dogs bum

Greg B wrote:You could get 6 x 2 MB card for, what, under AUD1,000

I just don't understand.

Speaking seriously for a moment (it's a Friday morning; whatcha expect?), with the ever increasing capabilities of our cameras, 12GB will indeed become quite common in the future. Just look at how quickly the D2x chews up space on a 1GB card; the high end Canons would be no different.

Also, carrying 6 2GB cards carries a risk of inserting the wrong one into the camera.

A valid point Gary.

On the other hand, a problem with your 12Mb card (loss or damage) will be much more serious that a problem with one of your six 2Mb cards.

gstark wrote:

Greg B wrote:You could get 6 x 2 MB card for, what, under AUD1,000

I just don't understand.

Speaking seriously for a moment (it's a Friday morning; whatcha expect?), with the ever increasing capabilities of our cameras, 12GB will indeed become quite common in the future. Just look at how quickly the D2x chews up space on a 1GB card; the high end Canons would be no different.

Also, carrying 6 2GB cards carries a risk of inserting the wrong one into the camera.

Indeed. Looking back 5-10 years, who would have thought we'd have PC's with 250+Gb HDD (and multiples of them) along with 2-4 Gb of RAM ?? The way technology is moving ahead (exponentially), in 2-3 years, the new cameras (with 20+MP) will have huge file sizes - requiring larger & faster storage than ever before.

Greg B wrote:A valid point Gary.

On the other hand, a problem with your 12Mb card (loss or damage) will be much more serious that a problem with one of your six 2Mb cards.

Which is why you'd need three of them, as Birdy has already indicated.

gstark wrote:Also, carrying 6 2GB cards carries a risk of inserting the wrong one into the camera.

And for the astronauts, they only need one card for their entirely trip.
If they have so many CF cards, acidentally, they fall out of the bag and they have to play the game: "catching flies" inside their spaceship

Aussie Dave wrote:Indeed. Looking back 5-10 years, who would have thought we'd have PC's with 250+Gb HDD (and multiples of them) along with 2-4 Gb of RAM ?? The way technology is moving ahead (exponentially), in 2-3 years, the new cameras (with 20+MP) will have huge file sizes - requiring larger & faster storage than ever before.

Dave, exactly.

I expect the next round of Nikon sensors (after they've bled the D2x 12MP unit downstream to the consumer classes - which we'll start to see happening later in the year) to be in the realm of 20 - 24 MP, and still in the DX size. I don't expect to see these announced for another 15 months or so - Photokina next year would be my earliest guess, but from a marketing perspective, that may still be a bit too early for Nikon's liking.

Two years later we might expect to see Nikon bring out a full frame sensor; 40-50MP perhaps ?

Just imagine the storage needed for that baby's output.

gstark,

Two years later we might expect to see Nikon bring out a full frame sensor; 40-50MP perhaps ?

That what I'm waiting for and I have the lenses for it on stanby!
Woohoo! full frame DSLR, my dream of.

gstark wrote:Dave, exactly.

I expect the next round of Nikon sensors (after they've bled the D2x 12MP unit downstream to the consumer classes - which we'll start to see happening later in the year) to be in the realm of 20 - 24 MP, and still in the DX size. I don't expect to see these announced for another 15 months or so - Photokina next year would be my earliest guess, but from a marketing perspective, that may still be a bit too early for Nikon's liking.

Two years later we might expect to see Nikon bring out a full frame sensor; 40-50MP perhaps ?

Just imagine the storage needed for that baby's output.

It will be very interesting to see what they decide to bring out over the next few years.

I feel that the market have meandered around the 8-12MP range for long enough and the next wave will have a significant increase, as you suggest.

It would be pointless for Nikon/Canon to bring out a new D3X/EOS 30D with 12-16MP as it isn't a big enough increase to make much difference. Jumping up to 20+ will have a huge impact. However, it will take all other manufacturers of PC hardware/software to lift their game as well so new dSLR users aren't "bottle-necked" behind their systems. Hopefully MS are keeping this in mind when they create their new Windows Vista OS....and CF/SD card manufacturers are finding faster ways to process images and upload cards to PC.

Won't be too long before we start seeing HDD listed as 1Tb (1000 Gb), and PC's running on 20Gb RAM.

Might have to move my current doorjam (286 8Mhz PC and put my old PII 400Mhz in it's place....so my P4 3Ghz machine can move over for the new machine on it's way)

Dave,

You've raised another inteersting point here.

Aussie Dave wrote:I feel that the market have meandered around the 8-12MP range for long enough and the next wave will have a significant increase, as you suggest.

It would be pointless for Nikon/Canon to bring out a new D3X/EOS 30D with 12-16MP as it isn't a big enough increase to make much difference.

Let's stop right there for a moment, and compare this with film imaging, if we may.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but I guess we should ask the question why would we upgrade our Nikon F4 to an F5 or F6 ? What features would we be looking for in the newer camera that would make us upgrade? The film component - which is the equivalent of the sensor in the digital world - has been a relatively level playing field for ... longer than I've been taking photos.


Is it a fair statement to say that the current crop of high end DSLRs - the D2x and the EOS 1Ds MkII say - perform well enough, and produce image qualities that match those of high end 100 ISO film?


If that is true, then are we looking at the next generation being a possible replacement for medium format cameras?

If it isn't, then would we expect that to be true of the following generation, and at that point we could again ask that preceding question?

My feeling is that one of these cases is probably going to be true, and for the future we can certainly look forward to some exceptionally high quality images, and perhaps the eventual demise of medium format.

Although I'm not sure that "look forward" is the most appropriate term to use in this instance.

Jumping up to 20+ will have a huge impact. However, it will take all other manufacturers of PC hardware/software to lift their game as well so new dSLR users aren't "bottle-necked" behind their systems.

While what you're saying is true, I don't see this as an issue. High end PC hardware is already there. With the passing of time, prices of this hardware will come down too. At the moment, you can buy a hell of a lot of computing power - with heaps of storage - for well under Au$1K.

Won't be too long before we start seeing HDD listed as 1Tb (1000 Gb), and PC's running on 20Gb RAM.

Leigh recently upgraded his system, and he's running a half Tb storage, but only 1Gb RAM. High end CPU and motherboard though, and he seems to be very happy with the results.

gstark wrote:Dave,

You've raised another inteersting point here.

Aussie Dave wrote:I feel that the market have meandered around the 8-12MP range for long enough and the next wave will have a significant increase, as you suggest.

It would be pointless for Nikon/Canon to bring out a new D3X/EOS 30D with 12-16MP as it isn't a big enough increase to make much difference.

Let's stop right there for a moment, and compare this with film imaging, if we may.

I'm not disagreeing with you, but I guess we should ask the question why would we upgrade our Nikon F4 to an F5 or F6 ? What features would we be looking for in the newer camera that would make us upgrade? The film component - which is the equivalent of the sensor in the digital world - has been a relatively level playing field for ... longer than I've been taking photos.


Is it a fair statement to say that the current crop of high end DSLRs - the D2x and the EOS 1Ds MkII say - perform well enough, and produce image qualities that match those of high end 100 ISO film?

Very true. A simple case of adding more resolution won't cut it to make people upgrade purely for this reason. I guess manufacturers would need to look at adding other abilities to the new style cameras, perhaps things like inbuilt VR (which is starting to show it's head) , better noise reduction systems, of course more MP, maybe even something as "out there" as wireless PC interface, so the camera could upload images to the PC/laptop whilst it is waiting for the next shot to be taken ?? This may not be much of an advantage to amateurs, but to professionals, I'm sure they'd love to view on their laptop what they'd just shot (without the restriction of wires going everywhere) ?!?

If that is true, then are we looking at the next generation being a possible replacement for medium format cameras?

If it isn't, then would we expect that to be true of the following generation, and at that point we could again ask that preceding question?

My feeling is that one of these cases is probably going to be true, and for the future we can certainly look forward to some exceptionally high quality images, and perhaps the eventual demise of medium format.

Although I'm not sure that "look forward" is the most appropriate term to use in this instance.

I'm sure medium format will eventually be overcome by digital. The majority of people don't need to be able print billboard sized photos, however the marketing hype that would ensue these cameras....being able to crop them so much and still make beautiful 8x10"s would be a selling point that alot of "average Joe's" would pay money for...IMHO

Jumping up to 20+ will have a huge impact. However, it will take all other manufacturers of PC hardware/software to lift their game as well so new dSLR users aren't "bottle-necked" behind their systems.

While what you're saying is true, I don't see this as an issue. High end PC hardware is already there. With the passing of time, prices of this hardware will come down too. At the moment, you can buy a hell of a lot of computing power - with heaps of storage - for well under Au$1K.

Leigh recently upgraded his system, and he's running a half Tb storage, but only 1Gb RAM. High end CPU and motherboard though, and he seems to be very happy with the results.

This is also true, for now. With the latest systems available, working with 10-20Mb uncompressed RAW files is certainly do-able....but what will happen when the new cameras first arrive and RAW files are double/triple this size ?? A serious PC will be required in order to process these files in a timely manner. Eventually, as always, technology would step up and prices would fall....but only those that can afford to buy the latest PC equipment would have that advantage.

Admittedly, if you could afford to go purchase the latest top-end dSLR when it's first released - chances are you can drop a few extra $$$ on some better PC equipment to suit....

gstark wrote:If that is true, then are we looking at the next generation being a possible replacement for medium format cameras?

For film yes, but MF digital backs level the playing field again...