Help requested for moonrise shots

[ozimax]

I tried photographing the moonrise last night on Woolgoolga beach. It was one night after full moon, rose at exactly 8.45pm, but too much cloud was evident. Tonight looks clearer for a 9.19pm rise.

Last night's efforts weren't crash hot. I was using a tripod and kit lens @ F3.4 - F4, with shutter speed of 15 sec thru to 30 sec exposure, at ISO varying between 200 and 800.

Does anyone know of which settings for D70 and kit lens would be good for photographing the moon and stars. I realise that you can't hold the lens open too long because all the heavenly bodies move quickly.

Any help from some experts would be appreciated, with thanks, Max

[gstark]

Max,

Remember that the moon is actually quite a brightly lit object.

therefore, if you want it to not be overexposed, try a starting point of around 1/500 @ f/5.6 or f/8, and work from there.

[ozimax]

Thanks Gary, will try that, I'm trying to get it as it rises over the horizon and reflects on the ocean etc. Last night it was blood red but mostly covered by cloud.

[ozimax]

One other question, what ISO do you recommend?

[xorl]

Also, you will find the moon moves quite fast across the sky. You probably don't want to go any slower than 1/60 or 1/125 (with a sturdy tripod). I'd use the lowest ISO possible that gives a reasonable shutter speed (as above) and aperture. Depending on the lens you will probably want to stop down a bit for extra sharpness (eg, f8 ).

If you are after star trails a full manual camera & film still beats digital - although the latest most expensive DSLRs can do ok as well. Dan Heller has a great site on star trails.

[Oneputt]

Ozi as already pointed out, the moon is a lot brighter than you would think. One shot I took recently was 5 secs at f11 and the result was good.

[ozimax]

Thanks Mark, that site you mentioned has some amazing images indeed.

[Matt. K]

Gary hit it right on the button. ISO 200 and 1/500 at f/8 or f/5.6. It's almost like taking pics on earth during the day. Almost every photographer grossly overexposes his or her first moon shots.

[Gordon]

...Does anyone know of which settings for D70 and kit lens would be good for photographing the moon and stars. I realise that you can't hold the lens open too long because all the heavenly bodies move quickly.

Full Moon overhead is lit by the same light source (the Sun) as Earth, and from the same distance, so exposures of the surface are going to be pretty close to what you would use for terrestrial photographs, in theory. You might find the Moon looks a bit dark in places if you use the same exposure as for a sunny landscape- thats because the moon's albedo is about the same as a lump of coal! it should be dark. So at the D70's ISO 200 a good starting point will be 1/250 @ f/11, when its overhead.

However, since you are photographing it as it rises, you are looking through as much as 40 Earth atmospheres, which is going to remove much of the light that was heading your way. So you are going to have to use longer exposures and or wider apertures. How much? well that all depends on exactly how much dust/water/aerosols/pollution (not much at Woopi!)/smoke/cloud etc is in the air.

Exposures for the stars are going to need to be much longer than for the moon, since they are much fainter.
Also important is that they will record proportionally to the actual aperture of the lens (not the f/#) . A 200mm @ f/2 will record a lot more stars than a 50mm @ f/2 in the same time. Thats because the stars are essentially point sources of light, increasing the magnification doesn't increase their size, so they record proportional to the area of the lens, (square of the radius X pi). Extended objects ( pretty much everything except the stars) that are magnified by longer folcal length will still record the same at f/2 though, no matter what focal length, neglecting lens transmission losses etc.

Now if you want to record the moon rising and theres a lot of haze around, you're in luck, because the landscape/seascape may be of similar brightness to the moon, so you can expose for the scene and the Moon wont be overexposed by much, if at all. You need to catch it low for that to work though.

In twilight this will sometimes be the case. If the moon rises when its dark, this isnt going to work very well, unless you have a brightly lit cityscape. You may want to do 2 seperate exposures and PS the properly exposed moon in later. You can use a longer focal length for the moon, and paste a larger than real moon in for effect too.

As Earth rotates, the Sun, Moon and stars appear to move across the sky, but the Moon actually moves more slowly than the others, due to its orbital motion around Earth. However, this wont save you from trailing when doing time exposures without an equatorial driven mounting.

A general rule of thumb for 35mm cameras to keep trails unnoticeable is:
600/focal length = exposure in seconds. So for a 50mm lens, this is 8 seconds. This is for the equatorial sky, you can get away with longer exposures towards the poles. At 60 degrees south in the sky (Southern Cross, pointers etc) the sky moves at half the speed, so you can double your exposure time to 16 seconds.
In practice you can use a bit longer, it depends on how much you plan to enlarge, and how sharp your lens is. However with the 2/3 size sensor in the D70, using 400/focal length may be safer... Experiment!

With the D70 for astro imaging I generally use 200 and up to 500. Beyond that the images are just too noisy with bands across them that cant be removed easily.

OK, that should have everone soundly sleeping

Gordon

[digitor]

Yes, the f16 sunny day rule applies here! For those who don't know, a shutter speed which is the inverse of your ASA (ISO) rating, at f16 will give correct exposure in sunlight. The moon is illuminated in full sunshine, after all, so this rule applies when it's in a clear sky.

Maybe shooting low over the water in hazy conditions through clouds will need a bit more, try it and see - histograms and flashing highlight displays take all the guesswork out of it.

Cheers

[Oneputt]

Ozi this was the image I was referring to. 5 secs F11 ISO 100. (it has been posted here before)

[gstark]

Max,

This is from our Sydney Night Shoot, almost 12 months ago.




ISO 200, 1/400, F9, Nikkor 80-400VR, handheld.

[xorl]

Thanks Gary, will try that, I'm trying to get it as it rises over the horizon and reflects on the ocean etc. Last night it was blood red but mostly covered by cloud.

The moon is so bright compared to the ground that you will need to take a double exposure (1 for the moon, 1 for the ground) and transplant the moon into the scene.
Alternatively you can shoot the moon around early morning/late evening. With a bit of careful planning you can work out what times of the day f/11 & 1/ISO is a suitable exposure for the ground. Then you can visit Geoscience Australia or similar to find moonrise/moonset times which suit.

[ozimax]

Thankyou all for some excellent feedback, especially Gordon, I will have to re-read all this to digest it fully.

I took a few photos last night from the Woopi headland but alas, cloud dominated the horizon. Will post a few shots from tomorrow, my Optus DSL a/c is now on slowdown at 28kbps because I have exceeded my download for this month!!

Incidentally, here is another link to determine when the moon will rise in your locality.

http://www.ga.gov.au/geodesy/astro/