Come and have a decent DAM discussion...!!!

[cyanide]

....

I initially wanted to do a poll but I had too many options for the system to accept, and cutting back on the choices made the poll less useful, so I’ve scrapped it...

ETA2: OK, decided to add a really simple poll to see if anyone uses a dedicated DAM software, or if most people are like me and just use a Windows or other O/S folder system....

I would like to start a(nother?) discussion on people's thoughts / plans / current systems for Digital Asset Management (DAM). Regardless of whether you have a simple system or a complex one, DAM is an unavoidable and integral part of any photographer's workflow.

As we all no doubt know, 'DAM system' technically includes everything from the hardware on which you store your photos through to the software you use to manage / retrieve them. I am happy to discuss all aspects of DAM, but am particularly interested in software, as that is what vexes me at the moment. Plus, the hardware/storage part of DAM is often covered in “Backup / Archive” threads.

I have been reading on the topic for a while; recently bought 'The DAM book' by Peter Krogh (http://www.thedambook.com/); and am now knee-deep in ideas (and enthusiastically wading further in! )

Software is the next big DAM decision for me, and the main reason I started this thread. To date I have only used a simple system of date-order folders, searching them via Windows 'My Computer'. My next challenge is to properly organise and classify my photos, and hopefully make them more easily locatable. I want to start using metadata / EXIF / XMT info more effectively. I really need to decide on DAM software... I like the sound of iMatch but the reality of learning it is a bit daunting... It's really hard to choose this software!

I probably wouldn't have been this keen to get DAM organised if it was just my normal snapshots, but I am starting a project to scan and catalogue a heap of family photos dating back many generations, and need to have them well catalogued....


So, some questions:

How / why did you choose the DAM software you are currently using? What are its pros? Cons?

What file naming system do you use? i.e. do you change the file from the original "DSCXXXX"?

In your own setup, to what extent are you going with DAM? Are you using a controlled vocabulary for keywords?

Do you consider that having your photos searchable via keywords is necessary if you are not a professional or semi-professional?


Tell me all your DAM thoughts!!!!!


PS - I will be posting this on a couple of other boards as well, to get a wide range of opinions.

[Matt. K]

cyanide
I have been in the process of setting up a digital image archive for my department. We hold about 30,000 negs that need to be digitised plus a continuing influx of digital camera files. I have been doing my research and now feel that I understand the major components of a workable system. The system must be set up so that imagery is retrieveable, accountable and secure. The inclusion of comprehensive metadata is the key to an archives value and to this end there are a number of programs that can handle this. I have experimented with a number of programs and I am going to settle on Mediadex (formely Cumulus) because of its ease of use and features. I have looked closely at Fotostation Pro and it has some outstanding features and is particularly powerful in its metadata and search features but I am a litte unsure of its folder seup....I much prefer the heirarchial file sytem of Mediadex. Others will prefer other programs for various reasons but the main thing to evaluate is the programs ability to display thousands of thumbails without screaming to a halt. I'm curious about the book you've mentioned....was it helpful? Did it discuss a controlled vocabulary?

[cyanide]

Matt,

Personally, so far I am finding the book very useful indeed, as it is an area I hadn't really focussed on before. It is a little Bridge-centric, but the concepts he explains are easily applicable to other software.

I am actually still not even half-way through my first reading of this book... and I may well need a couple of goes through before I absorb it all! I might reserve my judgement for a little while, but I will definitely come back to post my detailed thoughts.

It's only the first, most general chapter, but you can access a .pdf file of Chapter 1 here: http://www.thedambook.com/TheDAMBook_Chapter1.pdf

I found Ch 2 very useful in regards to metadata / keywords / controlled vocabulary. (See a chapter run-down here: http://www.thedambook.com/pages/contents.html) Not sure how much detail you are looking for, though... From a quick glance through the chapter list, it seems controlled vocabulary is only listed in Ch 2.

It's not a huge reference, only a few paragraphs. He basically explains what it is, how it is useful, and how few CV resources are available to the "individual photographers". (I assume he means a private individual without the budget of a company behind them.) He does go into more detail on keywords, though - how to build a good system, etc.

I do have a .pdf file of Ch 2 that I can email to people if they wish (I think it's OK to offer that - it was offered on the web as a downloadable preview previously....). I guess you will have to PM me with your email address if you'd like a copy.

[cyanide]

OK, decided to add a simple poll after all....

[rooboy]

I've got Krogh's DAM book - free books are the real perks of working in a bookstore . It's very thorough, although as mentioned is only really discussing Bridge, Camera RAW and DNGs on that end of the workflow, but is more open with the archiving/metadata/sotage software.

Matt, it has some info on controlled vocab, mostly advising you to use one and providing a few links. I'm happy to bring it along to the next mini meet if you or anyone else wants to have a flick through.

While I've looked through the book, I haven't ever gone beyond the rudimentary setup with folders:
Uploads (Raw files go in here in subfolders by date)
Processed
Printing
Temp

I realise that this will make finding old photos increasingly difficult, but the effort required to setup and maintain a proper DAM system doesn't seem all that worthwhile to lazy ol' me. Besides, hunting through old RAW files can be great fun, you never know what gems you'll dig up

[stubbsy]

Rae

I use iMatch and have almost completed making it the centrepiece of my asset management. I am writing an article for issue #2 of CHIMP (yes I know issue #1 isn't out yet) with all the gory details along with a predone iMatch setup for people to use as a starting point should they see fit. Worth mentioning is that the categories down the left where the folder icon is green (starting at Camera) are automatically created by iMatch using EXIF data.

Below is a screen shot of my setup (click for larger) to give you a feel for how it works.

[cyanide]

stubbsy - eagerly looking forward to your article. Your discussions (and advocations) of iMatch made me take a good look at it... and I have to say it is still in the top 3, for me...

[Steffen]

Peter, I'm looking forward to your article, too.

I had no idea that this whole subject had a name - DAM! I'm looking for something that does more than simply making searches for EXIF info more convenient.

An important issue would be automatic deduction of IPTC keywords from a controlled vocabulary, after simply supplying a few hints. I've played with some software that does this impressively, but the full dictionaries that go with it are quite costly.

Another important issue is keeping track not only of negatives (RAWs) but also the edits I've put a lot of time into. These days all serious RAW converters/editors are not actually touching the original but saving the edit steps in a sidecar file. A good image/asset management systems needs to keep track of these sidecar files as well.

Ideally (in a few years time?) we'll have a digital imaging workflow framework that application developers can steer by, and allows interoperability between apps at various stages of the workflow (like we have elsewhere in the software industry *cough*bullshit*cough*... )

Cheers
Steffen.

[Steffen]

I've got Krogh's DAM book - free books are the real perks of working in a bookstore

You lucky bastard! Working in a bookstore - that must feel like a maggot in the bacon (like we say in German)...

Cheers
Steffen

[DaveB]

I've been using iView MediaPro for quite a while, and have a good workflow going with DNGs and Adobe Camera Raw.
At the moment I'm doing a lot of work in Lightroom, although at Beta3 it doesn't play quite as nicely as it could (updating the DNG previews would be nice, and interoperating with ACR would be killer). But my Lightroom files are still under MediaPro management so to speak. Maybe at some point Lightroom might take over from MediaPro for my photos, but we'll see how that product matures...

I have iView catalogs with photo collections in them, but I also have catalogs indexing the "stuff" area under my home directory, containing everything including content I've created, PDFs/etc downloaded from the web, etc. For example it's easy for me to track down all the PDF camera manuals I have.
It's also convenient for little jobs: for example if someone hands me a CD full of JPEGs to use for a project I will make a new catalog indexing just that material. Browsing, searching, identifying subsets, even doing slideshows, it's all easy.

What file naming system do you use? i.e. do you change the file from the original "DSCXXXX"?

The photos get renamed on import, using the EXIF Capture Date and a unique ID that's allocated to the image. For example, a photo I took this afternoon at 2:41pm was allocated the id "F1_5B36", and the filename is 200608231441_F1_5B36.dng. I could omit the date/time from the filename as DAM software typically pulls that out of the file anyway, but this allows sensible access via the OS file dialogs. Files being sent to customers get renamed to lose the date/time info, but the ID remains.
The ID ("F1_5B36") also ends up embedded in one of the metadata fields, where it's used in places such as HTML gallery generation (e.g. "I'd like to licence image N1_10DA"...).

In your own setup, to what extent are you going with DAM? Are you using a controlled vocabulary for keywords?

Everything gets indexed. I try to be consistent with keywords, but it's an area I'm constantly tweaking.

Do you consider that having your photos searchable via keywords is necessary if you are not a professional or semi-professional?

That's up to you. I am a professional so I can only theorise about the answer.
But even if I'm taking photos just for me, I know I would probably lose track of them if they weren't indexed! I've had my library searchable by date since 1999, and I think that's an important minimum step. But when I added keywords in 2003 everything became a bit easier.


None of my systems automatically track derived versions of files (which includes just subsequent PSD/TIFF versions of files, as well as the results of HDR and panoramic merges) so at the moment I'm keeping track of those with filenaming tricks (and the image ID is automatically inherited in the metadata in most cases). It will be interesting to see what automation of this Lightroom can provide, and possibly MediaPro.
It will be interesting to see what happens to iView over time now that Microsoft owns them. But for now it's still a great cross-platform product (I use it on Macs, and my wife can access the catalogs from her XP box).

[Matt. K]

The more you put into this the more you get out. For instance...how would you keyword a picture of a cat? Keywords should be cat/feline/pet/moggie/tabby etc. When you have 100,000 images then the ability for anyone to search the database is essential. Setting up an archive is like placing the first brick in a castle. You have to get it right from the start.

[Sandy Feet]

I'm having a play with this iMatch program and am wondering how you get the categories list on the right hand side as displayed in the image

Cheers
Rod

[stubbsy]

I'm having a play with this iMatch program and am wondering how you get the categories list on the right hand side as displayed in the image

Cheers
Rod

Rod

You can't. It shows at the bottom. If you look at my screen shot above you can see below the image I have the IPTC tab showing. If you want to see categories there you'd click the Categories tab

[Sandy Feet]

Hey Stubbsy,

I'm talking about the list down the right hand side of the screen shot which starts with "copy, move, assign and then goes into categories such as Black & White ect"

Im interested how you get that toolbar/ categories

Cheers
Rod

[stubbsy]

Rod - sorry for the delay in replying. Here's what you do:

- Make sure the "One click dialog bar" is visible down the right hand side. If it isn't hit Ctrl-Alt-6

- choose the Assign tab in the one-click bar

- click the Configure button at the bottom

- In the dialog box that appears, click Add and then choose the category you want

- repeat the previous step for each category required

- when done, click OK

Now you can assign a category to any image or group of images that you've selected by clicking the button.