All forum members should have a crack at this.

[Matt. K]

http://www.moranprizes.com.au/photographic_open.php

Just do it for the experience.

[beetleboy]

I find this clause interesting:

22 - In consideration of Moran accepting the entry into the MCPP, the entrant consents, and Moran reserves the right, to
reproduce all entries received in all publications and publicity for the MCPP, inclusive of all electronic/digital or print
media. Moran is not liable to pay the entrant any fee, royalty or other form of remuneration for this right.

They can use your image(s) even if you don't win.

[mark]

Thanks Matt, I will.

Beetleboy - I guess for some this would seem a bit rude and imposing on behalf of the organisers, but I'm sure there are just as many others that would be delighted at the opportunity to have their photo used irrespective of winning a prize.


Edit: I just noticed this

There are no entry fees for the Secondary or Primary Schools Sections. Each student, or group of students, may submit up to three entries.

I am going to let Sam, (my 8 year old son) have a go too.

[beetleboy]

I understand your point of view Mark but at the end of the day these companies often build large photo libraries from these competitions. If they have $60,000 to give away as prize money, what's stopping them from hiring a pro and keeping us photog's employed?!

The AIPP and ACMP both agree that these kinds of clauses are detrimental to the photography industry.

I'm all for this company running a competition, choosing some finalists and awarding them..why must they have the right to use ALL entries as they see fit?

Sorry to take this thread but this is a hot topic!

[Ronza]

Been collating my entries and trying to cut them back to 10 images as per the limit. Luckily for me I'll qualify for the "Secondary" competition muhaha; no entry fee.

For $17k they can have any of my shots, at a shot at $17k and the glory, granting them licensing doesn't sound that bad.

[beetleboy]

As long as you win Ronnie..otherwise they have the right to keep your image(s) on file and use is it/them completely free (forever).

[Yi-P]

This must be a very tough challenge!!

So many photographers around and 10 per each for the Open season, that is thousands of great photographs to be rated.

[Reschsmooth]

There was an article in Capture mag a while ago (if I recall) that talked about the problems of comps which allow the organisers permanent and free use of entrants' photos. The basic argument was that these comps are basically a means of stocking libraries.

(Bear in mind I have no experience with any photo competitions whatsoever).

P

[Manta]

I must admit, I'm now in the camp that has a problem with this sort of comp, due to what's already been mentioned here. Sure, someone wins but, in the final washup, it's photographers that are the ultimate losers, IMHO. It's like flooding the market with a cheap product that others are trying to sell for a reasonable price. To me, it devalues the legitimate work of professional shooters. Cheap stock photo sites do the same thing. Just my thoughts.

[Alex]

I must admit, I'm now in the camp that has a problem with this sort of comp, due to what's already been mentioned here. Sure, someone wins but, in the final washup, it's photographers that are the ultimate losers, IMHO. It's like flooding the market with a cheap product that others are trying to sell for a reasonable price. To me, it devalues the legitimate work of professional shooters. Cheap stock photo sites do the same thing. Just my thoughts.

 LOL, Manta, just like dumping in customs . Couldn't agree more, though...

Alex

[DaveB]

I find this clause interesting:

22 - In consideration of Moran accepting the entry into the MCPP, the entrant consents, and Moran reserves the right, to reproduce all entries received in all publications and publicity for the MCPP, inclusive of all electronic/digital or print media. Moran is not liable to pay the entrant any fee, royalty or other form of remuneration for this right.

They can use your image(s) even if you don't win.

Of course, this may be intended as the limited proposition to use the images in promoting future competitions (not for any and all uses). Clause 10 specifies that more clearly for prize-winning entries, but the wording in clause 22 isn't as clear as I would like.

It's not necessarily as evil as you might be assuming... Maybe it's evil intent, maybe it's just stupidity...
If you don't like it, contact them and query them as to the intent of clause 22 (why have it when they already have clause 10?).

[Heath Bennett]

I wont be entering. I hate even the slight whiff of a rat.

[mark]

I understand your point of view Mark but at the end of the day these companies often build large photo libraries from these competitions. If they have $60,000 to give away as prize money, what's stopping them from hiring a pro and keeping us photog's employed?!

The AIPP and ACMP both agree that these kinds of clauses are detrimental to the photography industry.

I'm all for this company running a competition, choosing some finalists and awarding them..why must they have the right to use ALL entries as they see fit?

Sorry to take this thread but this is a hot topic!

Liam - You have misinterpreted this clause. This clause relates to the use of images to promote the MCPP (Moran Contemporary Photographic Prize) only and as such should be considered fair play. You might like to read the terms & conditions of entry for The Archibald Prize which are not dissimilar in nature.

There is no way you could interpret this to mean they will use the images to create a stock library, as they exclude this by stating

to reproduce all entries received in all publications and publicity for the MCPP, inclusive of all electronic/digital or print media

I'm more inclined to believe the reason for this prize is more related to the following quotes from their web pages.

Doug Moran was inspired by the Australian public’s love of portraiture to create the Doug Moran National Portrait Prize. He also wanted to create a vehicle to support established and developing artists.

And

Run in conjunction with the Doug Moran National Portrait Prize, the MCPP is a national photographic competition created to promote contemporary photography and excellence in all forms of still photo-based artwork, including all types of analogue and digital photography.

$80,000 expenditure to create a stock library for a Health Care group with less than a dozen photos on their own web site, all of which look to have been taken by a professional photographer that they most likely paid for. I simply don't believe it and neither should you.

Now back to the original topic, I couldn't agree more with Matt's Subject line.

All forum members should have a crack at this.

[beetleboy]

You are correct Mark. I did misinterpret the clause as I wrongly assumed MCPP to be the coporate body and not the competition. Thank you for pointing that out.

So by what you're saying; they will only use images entered to promote the competition? I can't say I have a big issue with that since it's unlikely to be more than a handful of pic's.

I'm reconsidering. I might enter now!

And in future I'll attempt to make a better effort of interpreting the rules

[Manta]

Got me too Mark. I'll admit my cursory scan missed some salient points. Thanks for pointing out the differences.

[Willy wombat]

As long as you win Ronnie..otherwise they have the right to keep your image(s) on file and use is it/them completely free (forever).

I refuse to enter the competitions that conduct business like this. Its a rort.

[beetleboy]

So did anyone else enter this comp?

[the foto fanatic]

I hope many did. BTW, and not wanting to influence anyone one way or another, but do you know anything about Doug Moran and the Moran Group?

Doug Moran is one of those characters, like Lang Hancock and Kerry Packer, where it's hard to know where truth ends and fiction starts.

Just Google him and read. It's an eye-opener.

[beetleboy]

Had a quick read after your suggestion cricketfan - very interesting; seems there was an Australian Story about him in 2003..

http://www.abc.net.au/austory/content/2003/s932900.htm

[Ronza]

So did anyone else enter this comp?

Yep - I submitted my 10 Photos into the Secondary Category. Actually spoke to the organiser Danielle Nolan (IT issues).

Two interesting points cropped up in conversation

a) The Moran portrait prize has been running for ages; the photography prize however is in its inaugural year. Might explain the lack of photography on the site and the lack of "past winner".

b) In relation to the copyright concerns - the point mark picked up on was confirmed by Danielle. If the image becomes a finalist it will be used only to promote the MCPP and the competition.

The finalist are announced later next week (around the 8th) so hopefully my $17 000 cheque will be on its way by the 15th

[beetleboy]

You lucky bugger Ronnie! I wanted to enter 8 images but the open section costs $25 per entry so I only entered 1!!

I also spoke to Danielle cos my credit card transaction failed and the site had no means of me attempting it again!

Hoping my $40,000 cheque will be in the mail soon

[Ronza]

Received a call today from Danielle; 3 of my shots were selected as finalists for the secondary division Absolutely stoked with that, scrambling now to get the stuff printed and delivered in time to the Moran group.

[Ronza]

Err, the photos that they ended up choosing.



The Usual Suspects; Sydney, NSW. October 2006


Palm Beach, NSW. December 2006


Anonymous Consumerism; Melbourne, VIC. December 2006

[Matt. K]

Ronza
Good luck mate! I think you are in with a chance.

[Willy wombat]

Good luck mate - that is great for you that you have been selected as a finalist!

[beetleboy]

Holy crap! 3!

Good work Ronnie!

Haven't heard anything RE the open division as yet.

[Alpha_7]

Excellent Stuff Ronnie, I had a feeling you'd do well, but 3 IS OUTSTANDING!!!!

Got my fingers and toes crossed for you... hmmm any thoughts on what you'd spend the prize money on if you won ?

[Ronza]

:O; just an update - the first image at Town Hall Station has been shortlisted to the Top 5 by the judges. Received a call from the Moran Group yesterday and they'll be flying me into Sydney next week for the gallery opening and press conference on the 13th!

1/5 shot at the big money, pretty stoked

Hopefully if I spend the (Adelaide) long weekend there, I'll try and meetup with some of the Sydney dSLRUsers folk

[macka]

Congrats, Ronza, this is a great achievement! Enjoy your trip.

[rooboy]

Well done Ronza

I can't see the other finalists on the website, do you know which other 4 were selected?

[Alpha_7]

Congratulations Ronza, whether you win or lose at this point Top 5, is massive and very well deserved. Congratulations!

[Matt. K]

Good show. Oh, and good luck!

[Ronza]

So I've just come downstairs from the State Library - the press conference just took place to announce the winners. While the official results are "media embargo'ed" until 6PM, tune into the 7.30 Report or the ABC News this evening and you might see me

[owen]

All the best Ronza. Exciting! I'll try tuning in.

[Alpha_7]

I'll make sure the Toppy is set to tape.

[Ronza]

Im at the opening now - ducked out of the gallery from boredom and tension (no one knows the results and we can't say anything).

[Yi-P]

All the best Ronnie

[Sherlock]

Good luck Ronza! I'm sure nick will be stoked on an EOS (personal joke )

[radar]

Amazing result Ronza,

congrats on winning, just caught you on the ABC News, bloody fantastic,

André

[Alpha_7]

34k, Nice work Ronza well done, I really liked that shot the first time you posted it, nice little earner for you, well done!

[michael_]

damn congrats ronza, 34k you must be over the mooon, what you upgrading to?

[radar]

It's actually only $17k to Ronza and $17k to his school.

Didn't Canon announce a new camera recently

[drifter]

Wow .Congrats Ronza.

[ozczecho]

Mate well done....a great image..well deserved and as the old saying goes.."you gotta be in it to win it..." Again well done...

[marcotrov]

Congrats Ronza. Well deserved and to have reached top 5 that's terrific. Good luck!
cheers
marco

[Matt. K]

Well done Ronza! Just caught your pic shown on the ABC news with a close up of the Cuban boy. Enjoy the kudos and think about your next challange.

[Dr Jan Itor]

Well done Ronza!

[DanielA]

[...] tune into the 7.30 Report or the ABC News this evening and you might see me

I hadn't been following this thread, so I was surprised to see you on the ABC news. Well done. Fantastic result. Well deserved.

Daniel

[Yi-P]

The 1D MkIII comes knocking on your doorstep right now eh??

[colin_12]

Great news Ronza. Congratulations.
Regards Colin