Mac or PC???

[W00DY]

I am seriously considering moving from a PC to a Mac primarily for my digital media.

At the moment I have quite a good PC (AMD 2800+, 1gig ram etc...) but I am not always happy with the way windows operates.

I have only ever played around on a mac (OS2) for a while never used it at length.

So has any one used both a PC and Mac extensivly (especially the new Panther OS) and if so which would they recommend and why?

Why should I change and move to a Mac???

Please be civil in your replys, don't bag the other operating system just point out why you prefer the one you do.

Cheers,

W00DY

[sirhc55]

Hi Woody

I am a Mac user and have Panther. I find the Mac platform very intuitive and easy to use.

For 8 months I had a mate staying with me who ran the latest Gigabit Intel type system and when we were both on our respective computers all I could hear was curses from him. I liked his system but when I went to a G4 1.25Gb plus 1Gb RAM he really could not believe that my system appeared in many cases to be faster than his 3Gb system!

But in all honesty there is no real difference between systems it is just up to the individual as to what he prefers.

I must admit that I really do like the look of the new iMac G5.

Good luck in your choice

Chris

[MHD]

Bahhhhhh!
GO THE PENGUIN!

[Nnnnsic]

I agree. Go to Tux (Go directly to Tux. Do not pass Bill. Do not collect 200 apples).

Yes, Mac OS is better, but I do not like how much an Apple costs nor how much they cost to upgrade anything.
Mac hardware prices are ridiculous, and moreso, if the chip gets replaced, you can't just buy a new motherboard and chip... Noooooo.... you have to buy a whole new system.
That just pisses me off.

You could try Linux (The Tux!) or the other incarnations of Windows (64-bit, Longhorn beta, etc) if you don't like your current version.
Remember, while most people assume PC means Windows, there are other choices.

[gstark]

The issue is not so obviously pc (and Windoze) vs Mac though: different implementations of the PC hardware have different internal (hardware) engineering solutions, and thus not all pcs are created equal.

From the software POV, there is little between the Mac and PC solutions; while Linux is a possible solution (we use it for our servers) as a user friendly, end user desktop solution, if you're not a geek, fergedaboutit!

So it comes back to hardware, and from this perspective you need to try to discern who has good underlying engineering built in. I would stay away from the more obviously consumer oriented systems, and look towards the more business oriented, but with good graphics capabilities.

[Nnnnsic]

This is true.
An iMac (even a G5 based iMac) is likely to be nowhere near as fast as you think or even as capable as one of its G5 Tower brothers.
Just one look at the iMac's video card and it shows you that it's not a strong contender for performance... a 5200... I wouldn't give one of those to an enemy.

[Killakoala]

Well, i've been using computers of all types, sizes, vintages and flavours for many, many years.

Frankly i think Windows XP (PRO) is fantastic and my laptop running it has had NO problems at all so far (touch wood), (P4-2GHz, 512 mb ram, 60Gb HDD). It runs Nikon capture, Nikon View and Photoshop 7.0 at the same time quite happily.

My choice for a computer system would be two points;
1. Price of the hardware and/or upgrades plus extras (ext HDD, DVD-burner, CF card readers, PDA compatibility)
2. Availability of software support and upgradeability. How much Freeware or pirated software can i download and use or trial

The PC Wintel combination wins hands down.

And as Leigh said above, stay away from an iMac. In fact, stay away from anything that is 'integrated'. They are a pain to fix when they break. This includes things like TV's with built-in DVD or video players, combo HiFi stereos etc.

(In My Honest Humble Opinion)

[sirhc55]

Well, i've been using computers of all types, sizes, vintages and flavours for many, many years.

Frankly i think Windows XP (PRO) is fantastic and my laptop running it has had NO problems at all so far (touch wood), (P4-2GHz, 512 mb ram, 60Gb HDD). It runs Nikon capture, Nikon View and Photoshop 7.0 at the same time quite happily.

My choice for a computer system would be two points;
1. Price of the hardware and/or upgrades plus extras (ext HDD, DVD-burner, CF card readers, PDA compatibility)
2. Availability of software support and upgradeability. How much Freeware or pirated software can i download and use or trial

The PC Wintel combination wins hands down.

And as Leigh said above, stay away from an iMac. In fact, stay away from anything that is 'integrated'. They are a pain to fix when they break. This includes things like TV's with built-in DVD or video players, combo HiFi stereos etc.

(In My Honest Humble Opinion)

Hi

Tell me if I am wrong but Laptops in my opinion would rate very much the same as any integrated computer - plus they are expensive!

I actually used a Mac for a long time that was totally upgradable and then replaced it with an “integrated” e-Mac G4 1.25Mb with 1Gb RAM.

Hanging off this computer I have a LaCie dual layer DVD burner and a card reader and half a terabyte of HD capacity. Plus this is all wireless (54Mb) to my Neuston Media Centre that enables playback of music, movies, photos and the Internet through my audio system and widescreen TV.

Basically the only thing I can’t do is upgrade the video card. But, as I am not a gamer, I see no need to have anything better than I have.

I must admit that for a while I did have and IBM laptop which was very good and a damn cheaper than the Macs

Chris

[Killakoala]

I'm glad to see that you have the same 'upgrade' path that i have chosen by adding things via USB. Such is the beauty of modern serial ports.

It's good that things have obviously changed since i last used an apple, and for that i please beg your forgiveness for my animosity towards all things Apple.

Not that i am pro-Gates or pro-Intel. (I am anti-Sony and anti-Nike though) But of course that's just my problem i have to deal with.

I'll climb off my bandwagon now.

[Matt. K]

I'm probably gonna get shot down here...but go the PC, and spend the rest of your money on lenses. A fast PC with 512 MB ram will do just about everything you want to do...unless you're printing out 5mtr x 7mtr images. I run a fairly modest PC and often print files of 200MB no problems. And Photoshop runs just fine.

[Greg B]

I am a PC person - and having used a Mac at one workplace for 12 months - I have no desire to change. (I never got over the absence of a right mouse button)

But having said that, I have to be fair - Macs aren't bad, in fact they are almost like real computers.

[W00DY]

Thanks for everyones replies... The choice not any easier

After thinking about it a little more I think the main reason I was looking to swap is becouse of the Mac monitors... They just seem so crisp (compared to PC CRT monitors).

Maybe I just need to upgrade my monitor with some calibrating software??? I guess this would be a much cheaper option as well.

Hmmmm, decisons, decisons...

W00DY

[MHD]

Mac monitors are awesome (and awesomely expensive) period.

[gstark]

Maybe I just need to upgrade my monitor with some calibrating software??? I guess this would be a much cheaper option as well.

What sort of graphics card and monitor are you currently using? While the calibration is important, the quality of both of these components is equally so as well.

Certainly, this would be a cheaper upgrade path, and when it comes time to upgrade the pc itself, if you're buying state-of-the-art by today's standards, it should stand you in good stead for reusability for about two years with the graphics card, and perhaps four or five years for the monitor.

[W00DY]

What sort of graphics card and monitor are you currently using? While the calibration is important, the quality of both of these components is equally so as well.

At the moment I have a Mitsubushi 19'' CRT Diamond view monitor, problem with this is there are green and red blurring occuring near some of the corners (no it is not in warranty).

The graphics card I have is Leadtek 128mb Ti4200 VIVO. I thought this was a good card when I bought it but maybe I do need to upgrade it?

Any suggestions on setup? Here is my setup as is today:

Motherboard - Asus A7N8X-X
CPU - AMD XP 2600+
RAM - 1gig PC2700 DDR
HD1 - 80gig Seagate (really only has the operating system and programs)
HD2 - 200gig external seagate (holds all my images, videos & music)
Video Card - Leadtek 128mb Ti4200 VIVO
Monitor - Mitsubushi 19'' CRT Diamond view

Any suggestions on my setup would be greatly appreciated, I am not all that up to date on PC hardware.

Cheers,

W00DY

[birddog114]

Woody,
How long did you have that monitor? Misubishi provides 3 years on-site.
What my POV is:
What do you want to achieve?
1/AMD 2600 is still OK for normal graphic user/ not great but adequate.
2/1.0Gb RAM is OK/ 2.0Gb RAM is not bad, though maximum support of WIN XP is 2.0Gb.
3/Video card is the one of your system weakness, I rather go up to ATI Radeon 9700/ 9800 or the new R800 with 256Mb DDR

http://www.gecube.com

4/ Mitsubishi 22" CRT monitor/ Mitsubishi 2070 is around $960.00

If money is not an issue then look at the following:

- AMD Athlon 64 3200+ Processor, Socket 754, HTSB 1.6Ghz, 512KB L2
Cache. ($330.00)
Or:
- AMD Athlon 64 3400+ Processor, Socket 754, HTSB 1.6Ghz, 512KB L2 Cache, Boxed ($455.00)
- ATI Radeon R800/ 256Mb AGP
- 01 x 80Gb for OS and misc.
- 02 x SATA 160Gb or 200Gb 0r 250Gb (applications and scratchdisk for PS or NC) perhaps RAID.
- 02 x 1Gb DDR
- ASUS A7N8X-E Deluxe Motherboard with WIFI - nForce2, 400 FSB, DDR400, 8x AGP (Pro), SATA RAID, USB2.0, IEEE1394, 2x 10/100/1000
LAN, ATX
- DVD-+/-RW/DL
- Card reader in floppy slot or 5.1/4 slot with USB.2 and firewire
and many other items to follow depend on your budget!!!!

[sirhc55]

What sort of graphics card and monitor are you currently using? While the calibration is important, the quality of both of these components is equally so as well.

At the moment I have a Mitsubushi 19'' CRT Diamond view monitor, problem with this is there are green and red blurring occuring near some of the corners (no it is not in warranty).

The graphics card I have is Leadtek 128mb Ti4200 VIVO. I thought this was a good card when I bought it but maybe I do need to upgrade it?

Any suggestions on setup? Here is my setup as is today:

Motherboard - Asus A7N8X-X
CPU - AMD XP 2600+


RAM - 1gig PC2700 DDR
HD1 - 80gig Seagate (really only has the operating system and programs)
HD2 - 200gig external seagate (holds all my images, videos & music)
Video Card - Leadtek 128mb Ti4200 VIVO
Monitor - Mitsubushi 19'' CRT Diamond view

Any suggestions on my setup would be greatly appreciated, I am not all that up to date on PC hardware.

Cheers,

W00DY

Hi Woody

Sounds like you may need to degauss your monitor - the other point is do you have any speakers etc near the monitor. Could be a magnetic field causing the problem.

Other than that I have gone with 2 17" monitors side-by-side (1 LCD and 1 CRT)

Regards

Chris

[W00DY]

If money is not an issue

Your a funny man Birddog

Thanks for your feedback. I guess I am looking to get the best performance out of my current system as possible. So in other words only upgrade what I need.

I can upgrade the RAM to 2gb as I do have another slot. I would prefer to keep the motherboard as it is to much stuffing around to change it (I might as well buy another system all together).

It sounds like I should upgrade the video card, will me current setup be able to run an ATI Radeon R800 or 9800???

Cheers.

[W00DY]

The other point is do you have any speakers etc near the monitor.

Actually I do have two speakers next to the monitor in these positions. I will move them when I get home. I do give it a degaus nearly everyday

Cheers,

W00DY

[sirhc55]

The other point is do you have any speakers etc near the monitor.

Actually I do have two speakers next to the monitor in these positions. I will move them when I get home. I do give it a degaus nearly everyday

Cheers,

W00DY

It’s normally because the speakers are not shielded as they should be. This does not happen on an LCD screen. The other point re CRT’s is that if you view them over many hours during a day the frequency can tire the eyes - another reason to go LCD

Chris

[MHD]

No having had looked extensively into this issue I can only give an subjective view which is that I much prefer LCD.... even if it is just for ergomic space issues...

[W00DY]

Has anyone used the Mitsubishi 17' LCD DV175???

http://www.arc.com.au/?MONMITSLCD175

Seems like a good price for $609.00

W00DY

[birddog114]

Has anyone used the Mitsubishi 17' LCD DV175???

http://www.arc.com.au/?MONMITSLCD175

Seems like a good price for $609.00

W00DY

1/ if you want to boost up to 2.0Gb then I think you have to sacrifice the existing memory modules, I don't know you have 4 x256 or 2 x512 and how many slots are together on the board?, you mentioned: it only has one empty slot, it means you have 3 slots, my guess. You end up with 2 x512Mb already and extra slot may not work with 1.0Gb chip.
2/ How did you degauss your monitor? do you have the degauss wand? or just a button hiding somewhere in the front of monitor's panel? need a wand to degauss it properly.
3/ Your PC will run OK with Radeon 9800 or R800
4/ Mitsubishi 175 LCD is just OK for daily job, sold number of them to corporate customers, it's not perfect for graphic or photo works, we have 6 PCs inhouse and all of them with Sony, BenQ + Samsung 17" + 19" LCD and use DVI inteface, they are around 16ms to 25ms refresh rate, done some photo editing but did not like them much, it's very hard to calibrate color to matching with printer and real color.
I ordered the Mitusbishi 2070/ 22" and sure will happy with it. Don't like the ideas of CRT much, old fashion though, but have to accept its reality and performance in comparison with LCD. Most Destop Publisher and Media Works they refused to have the LCD for replacement of CRT
5/ Tried the Viewsonic VP911 or 912 same as the Samsung 710N with 12ms but still can't perform the print works that I want.

[W00DY]

2/ How did you degauss your monitor? do you have the degauss wand? or just a button hiding somewhere in the front of monitor's panel? need a wand to degauss it properly.

Yeah just the degauss button, what is the wand?

3/ Your PC will run OK with Radeon 9800 or R800.

Is the Radeon 9200 128mg better than my current vide card?

4/ Mitsubishi 175 LCD is just OK for daily job, sold number of them to corporate customers, it's not perfect for graphic or photo works, we have 6 PCs inhouse and all of them with Sony, BenQ + Samsung 17" + 19" LCD and use DVI inteface, they are around 16ms to 25ms refresh rate, done some photo editing but did not like them much, it's very hard to calibrate color to matching with printer and real color.
I ordered the Mitusbishi 2070/ 22" and sure will happy with it. Don't like the ideas of CRT much, old fashion though, but have to accept its reality and performance in comparison with LCD. Most Destop Publisher and Media Works they refused to have the LCD for replacement of CRT
5/ Tried the Viewsonic VP911 or 912 same as the Samsung 710N with 12ms but still can't perform the print works that I want.

Which LCD monitor would you suggest to be the best value for money? so not neccesaryily the best but best for the money?

Cheers,

W00DY

[birddog114]

1/ The degauss wand is a round metal stick, and it's 400mm long, one end has the power cord, plug into wall power outlet and degauss the mon.
2/ The 9200 is miles far better than your Leadtek 4200 VIVO
Go for the 9600XT VIVO or 9600XT Bravo with 256Mb DDR 0.25 nanosecond/ around $230.00 GST inc.
3/ LCD or CRT?
Samsung 710N with 12ms $580.00/ 17" narrow bezel
Mitsubishi CRT MITS-DP93SB $490.00/ 19"
Your pick:
Mitsubishi 17" DV175 $525.00
All price are with gst

More to come if you want to know

[W00DY]

The 9200 is miles far better than your Leadtek 4200 VIVO. Go for the 9600XT VIVO or 9600XT Bravo with 256Mb DDR 2.5 nanosecond/ around $230.00 GST inc.

OK, the local computer shop in Chatswood has these prices:

9200SE 128mb TV DVI - $83.20
9200SE 64mb TV PCI - $96.60
9600XT 256mb VIVO - $294.70
9800 PRO 128mb 8x - $366.20

Based on those prices which one would you recommend? Keep in mind I do want to be able to play DOOM 3

Thanks for all your help birddog, my knowledge on hardware is limited.

[birddog114]

The 9200 is miles far better than your Leadtek 4200 VIVO. Go for the 9600XT VIVO or 9600XT Bravo with 256Mb DDR 2.5 nanosecond/ around $230.00 GST inc.

OK, the local computer shop in Chatswood has these prices:

9200SE 128mb TV DVI - $83.20
9200SE 64mb TV PCI - $96.60
9600XT 256mb VIVO - $294.70
9800 PRO 128mb 8x - $366.20

Based on those prices which one would you recommend? Keep in mind I do want to be able to play DOOM 3

Thanks for all your help birddog, my knowledge on hardware is limited.

I mentioned earlier the 9600XT 256Mb VIVO. Price is too expensive!!!! It's only $230.00 GST Inc. but if you happy to spend $294.70, go for it I have no comment. Once again, if you can afford the go for the 9800 PRO, what brand? did they tell you?

Check the following link, it takes you the graphic cards section:

http://www.gecube.com/productCategory.php

And Tom's hardware guide

http://graphics.tomshardware.com/graphi ... index.html

[Onyx]

MSY - home of cheap cheap hardware stuff. http://www.msy.com.au
They have a branch in Auburn - if you know how to put together computer parts, they'll save you a load of money. I used to frequent comp fairs, but I've since relied on them for parts. To gain access to "platinum member" prices, the login is MSY, password MSY. (duh)

Also a GF4 Ti4200 is about equivalent in performance to the ATI 9600XT. The 9200 is not such a good performer. It merely has support for the later DX9 standard. If you truly want to play Doom 3 at a reasonable frame rate, 9800Pro or better would be a recommended. Your 4200 might do at a stretch, if you cut down on the details and eye candy. A 9600 card is really not that much different from your 4200 to justify an upgrade IMHO.

[birddog114]

I have GF4 4200 TI from Leadtek and 9600XT Pro in my two sons's PCs.

They play Half Life/ Counter Strike/ Doom3 everyday on the Net (I never play any game on the Net).

Verdict:

The 9600XT is miles faster than the 4200 on the PC.
All PCs are with P4/3.0GHz/ 1.0Gb RAM/ various of installed Hdds but all are with 8Mb and 7200rpm.

The 9800XT or Pro version is more better, but if I upgrade them I'll go for the X800 PCI-E

MSY - I asked them yesterday the price for Power Color 9600XT/ 256Mb VIVO, they quoted me $285.00 and I can get for Woody $245.00 including shipping from Victoria.

[W00DY]

Well I can confirm that in my setup the R9600XT is 110% better then my older GF4 4200Ti.

The reason why I have not posted much is simple... DOOM 3

I am not really a gamer but this game is fun (not for the wife though).

Plus I also find my images are sharper and more vivid with this card... Is this possible or just my imagination???

Huge thanks to Birddog, once again he has offered a great deal to me, I only wish there was something I could repay him with, I guess cash is a good start

W00DY

[Raydar]

Well the time has come!!!!!

You’ll be getting some emails soon Birdy, I’m upgrading my PC.
First thing I need is a good Mummy board with a heap of DDR mem slots & one of the fastest AMD CPU’s you can muster up for me????

This poor old thing is starting to Pis# me off!!!!!!!

Cheers
Ray