Monopod discussion.

[W00DY]

Hi All,

There has been plenty said regarding which tripod and which head people think are best but not much said on Monopods.

Do many people use a monopod?
If so what are the advantages / disadvantages of a monopod over a tripod?
With the VR lenses is a monopod pretty much good enough in all situations?
Which Monopod do you use and why?

As I said in another thread I am looking at buying a tripod but I keep coming back to the same question: Should I just buy a monopod instead???

Look forward to your responses.

W00DY

[Mj]

As with many things... the simple answer is "depends"

The good:

Monopods are good in small spaces (i.e. taking pics at a footy match etc) or where you're off camping and have space/weight considerations or where you're doing a walk around shoot (e.g. around the Quay) and want some quick fairly painless extra support. They are also a far cheaper investment than a tripod.

The bad:

Monopods cannot give you the support that a tripod provides so in answer to your either/or question.... you need both. VR or no VR you cannot do a 30 sec low-light lanscape exposure without a tripod, you can also forget about pano shots or group portraits with you in them!!!

Which one:

I have a manfrotto 680B which is solid, not a bad weight, and I recommend it or similar (as would a number of others here).
Quite a few others have purchased a Fiesol carbon mono and so far most say they are happy (it's very light so good for camping etc, but may not hold up to longer term abuse)... you might wish to check with Gary and Glen to see how their's is holding up, assuming their getting plenty of use from it.

Hope this helps...

Michael.

[Oneputt]

Woody having used both, in my opinion the only advantage of a monopod is portability. Considerably more skill is required to use a monpod and there is a lot of technique involved. Unlike a tripod you can't use it hands free!

I am heading to the Kimberley in March and will take my monopod purely to save space and weight, for no other reason.

[stubbsy]

There has been plenty said regarding which tripod and which head people think are best but not much said on Monopods....

You mean nothing like this threadorthis one:D

[Glen]

With the VR lenses is a monopod pretty much good enough in all situations?

Woody, there is a photo I took last week of the bridge in another thread here on firmware. I had 15 minutes to take it before picking my wife up. I took both mono and tripod. I couldn't take that photo with a monopod, it kept falling over exposure was F8 for 5 secs. So you can see that a mono wont do everything (unless it is the Manfrotto self standing monopod)


I see 3 monos talked about here

Feisol - cheap, under $100, extremely light, not durable enough for really big guns

Manfrotto not sure of model - cheap, $100-$150, strong but probably double the Feisol in weight

Gitzo 1538 - Rolls Royce, light, durable, will take any size lens, expensive about $350


I chose the Feisol as it is light enough to always have with me.

Good luck

[Onyx]

Check pages 6, 7 and later of the Feisol thread. Lots more comments re: monopods in general and the use of them.

[birddog114]

I thought our senior members will do more search than newbies
Yes, agreed! heaps of info and comparison, how to use of monopod and tripod in our forum in the past

[Onyx]

Gitzo 1538 - Rolls Royce, light, durable, will take any size lens, expensive about $350

I wouldn't describe the Gitzo as "light". It seems to be about the same mass as the largest steel Manfrotto models - the 680/681's.

[Glen]

Sorry, Onyx, I should have said light for something about 50mm across and strong enough to support me sitting on top of it. Oooh, what a painful image just crossed my mind

[W00DY]

Hmmm - Surprising response to this thread...

Firstly - I hope we are all not going down the path of "we will not answer your question if it has been discussed before". You all realise this is going to get worse the more the forum grows.

Secondly - I honestly had not seen much discussion (other than the ones I have initiated within "tripod" threads) regarding monopods.

I was simply trying to get a monopod thread up rather then hide some info within a tripod thread.

I would suggest that if people don't have anything useful to say other than "do a search" than don't post at all. I for one will try an answer any questions that are posted regardless if they have been discussed before. That is the nature of a friendly community.

I can understand some peoples frustration regarding this but then they don't need to reply to every thread created.

Sorry if this sounds harsh, rude, stupid whatever but this issue has been getting worse lately and is only going to increase as the forum grows.

Admins feel free to close this thread if you don't think it is a valid discussion.

W00DY

ps: Thank you to MJ, Oneputt & Glen for their replies.

[stubbsy]

Firstly - I hope we are all not going down the path of "we will not answer your question if it has been discussed before". You all realise this is going to get worse the more the forum grows.

Woody I'd hope not either (even though I'm firmly in the look elsewhere responses above). Here's my take on the "look elsewhere" issue:

• If I'm aware of a thread that pretty exhaustively covers the topic I'll track it down and post a link to that thread.
• If someone's a newb I'll also point out the search tool for the future and explain why it's useful (cuts down on cross posts, consolidates in one place etc)
• If I'm unaware of another thread on the topic I'll post in the current one (ie I don't go searching for a thread that answers a post before I post a reply
• I will NEVER say something as bald as "if you'd only done a search first you'd find your answer" since that helps no-one

Secondly - I honestly had not seen much discussion (other than the ones I have initiated within "tripod" threads) regarding monopods.

That's fine - it's not possible to read and recall every thread - hence the thrust of the post I made I guess (which was intended as a poke in the ribs and if taken otherwise I apologise)

I was simply trying to get a monopod thread up rather then hide some info within a tripod thread.

I think your idea of getting a monopod thread only is a good one, but maybe what we need do is to consolidate some of these sorts of details from the existing threads into a new one in the absolute beginners section (or maybe even a new FAQ section?). To that end I have over the last few weeks been collecting together tips & hints from various threads for a consolidated posting. I think something like this for popular topics like monopods, tripods, heads, lenses & the like might go a long way towards cutting down cross posting since, the info would all be neat and in one place.

I would suggest that if people don't have anything useful to say other than "do a search" than don't post at all.

Well put and I agree (but I'll still relapse occasionally and make a comment like I did above)

I for one will try an answer any questions that are posted regardless if they have been discussed before. That is the nature of a friendly community.

Exactly and that's to be encouraged.

Sorry if this sounds harsh, rude, stupid whatever but this issue has been getting worse lately and is only going to increase as the forum grows.

I don't think this either harsh or rude. I think it is honest and you have a right to make your opinion known. That's what we all treasure about the forum.

Amins feel free to close this thread if you don't think it is a valid discussion.

Hmmm.. How do you define what's valid. Nothing wrong with a healthy debate. I'd hope the admins DON'T see a need to close the thread.

Sorry for the long post, but I agree with you that this is an important issue.

[W00DY]

That's fine - it's not possible to read and recall every thread - hence the thrust of the post I made I guess (which was intended as a poke in the ribs and if taken otherwise I apologise)

Stubbsy, I agree it is good to post references to other posts.

I actually don't think starting a new thread on an issue is al that bad. With the number of new users joining the forum it gives them a chance to have their say on the topic. They are not going to search and rehash a thread form 6 months ago.

W00DY

[birddog114]

Hi All,
I agreed with stubbsy on these issues, perhaps if this thread is posted in the Asolutely Beginner Questions then the answer might be difference, though Woody has been here long enough and there are many threads about those legs and monopod, of course, if they are not answer all your questions then you can revise that thread, not neccessary to start a new thread with the same questions and ideas.
Secondly, you have been in few meets and saw all the legs and monopod, same as the use for them and always welcome you to other meets and try all the available tripods, monopods onsite same as talking to other members about their experiences.
I do answer some duplicate posts mainly for new members who recently joined and have the same question which has just discussed or posted but also mentioned to them where they can find their answer quickly.

[stubbsy]

Woody.

And for my answer to your question - I have a manfrotto 679B mono and no tripod. I decided it was better to have good glass than good legs since the glass will be used more than the legs (I have Nikon 12-24DX, 24-120 VR & 70-200 VR). I went for VR to partly make up for no tripod. For me, I want the ease of movement hand held gives without the awkwardness of a tripod to move around. Having said all that, for your pending Kosciosko walk I'm guessing you'll be taking lots of panos and a tripod does have an edge there (but only just and it WILL be heavier to carry).

And finally - remember metal be it tripod or monopod can get pretty damn cold in the snow.

[Oneputt]

Whilst the Search function can be useful, sometimes it cannot be defined clearly enough to find what you need. I recently tried it but cpuldn't find what I wanted so I started a new thread and got the answer I needed almost immediately.

I am involved with another long running forum using the same setup and likewise the search button there is not really that useful. I like Birddogs response to this question.

[W00DY]

Hi All,

I agreed with stubbsy on these issues, perhaps if this thread is posted in the Asolutely Beginner Questions then the answer might be difference

I don't think it shoudl matter where a thread is posted, but anyway feel free to move it there if you think best.

Secondly, you have been in few meets and saw all the legs and monopod, same as the use for them and always welcome you to other meets and try all the available tripods, monopods onsite same as talking to other members about their experiences.

Yes I have been to a few meets and enjoyed everyone of them. I will also attend many more. However this does not mean I know about the topic.

When I have been to the meets it has been mainly for meeting all the people and getting to know them. I have not paid much attention to the monopods, tripods or heads becouse I have not been interested in purchasing one. I have paid a lot more attention to the lenses at the meets as that was what I was buying at the time.

I do answer some duplicate posts mainly for new members who recently joined and have the same question which has just discussed or posted but also mentioned to them where they can find their answer quickly.

Yes, I have seen you answer some other posts unfortunatley I did't like your answer to this post

I was not attacking anyone with my previous post just pointing out that maybe there are better ways to answer threads

W00DY

[W00DY]

Woody.

And for my answer to your question - I have a manfrotto 679B mono and no tripod. I decided it was better to have good glass than good legs since the glass will be used more than the legs (I have Nikon 12-24DX, 24-120 VR & 70-200 VR). I went for VR to partly make up for no tripod. For me, I want the ease of movement hand held gives without the awkwardness of a tripod to move around. Having said all that, for your pending Kosciosko walk I'm guessing you'll be taking lots of panos and a tripod does have an edge there (but only just and it WILL be heavier to carry).

And finally - remember metal be it tripod or monopod can get pretty damn cold in the snow.

Good information Stubbsy, thanks.

[Glen]

Woody, I think these posts were just a gentle nudge that your first three questions had been discussed during your 745 post tenure here. Don't take it personally, I am sure it wasn't meant that way. I thought the fourth question was new and valid, so answered from my personal experience and what I had seen on the board. Hope the future responses are helpful

[W00DY]

Woody, I think these posts were just a gentle nudge that your first three questions had been discussed during your 745 post tenure here. Don't take it personally, I am sure it wasn't meant that way. I thought the fourth question was new and valid, so answered from my personal experience and what I had seen on the board. Hope the future responses are helpful

Yeah but does that mean I have read them???

The majority of my time on this forum is spent looking at the review section as I love seeing other peoples images... I have tried (up until now) to stay out of these threads as they have not benn of interest.

How is this different to a new user coming onto the forums?

Once again sorry if i sound frustrated but I guess I am. Just becouse I have posted 700 messages does not mean I have also read all the threads that go through here.

As a lot of other users have said the forum is getting very difficult to keep up with so it is impossible to read all threads and the search function is not all that great.

W00DY

[birddog114]

Yes, I have seen you answer some other posts unfortunatley I did't like your answer to this post

I was not attacking anyone with my previous post just pointing out that maybe there are better ways to answer threads

Yes, I 'm assuming once you attended at the meet, you discovered them all not in one time but there're many, same as yesterday you posted a thread about tripod and same to day as the monopod, why don't you used your original thread to expand your question instead of starting a new one with the same idea and btw once you have been on this forum long enough I think you may read or follow all the related posts, if not, you may define your search in "Equipment Review" section and you knew all about it.

Once the forum grown to 1000+ members, what are we going to do? keep repeating answer all the same question as we have been discussed lately, or pointing new members to the existing threads?

[W00DY]

Yes, I 'm assuming once you attended at the meet, you discovered them all not in one time but there're many, same as yesterday you posted a thread about tripod and same to day as the monopod, why don't you used your original thread to expand your question instead of starting a new one

Becouse I fell that a thred on Monopods should be seperate to a thread on Tripods....

Just my opinon.

[stubbsy]

Woody, birddog

My assumption was that Woody, given the number of posts, would be pretty much across the threads in the forum (not reading all, but having at least seen the names of the posts). Having read Woody's comments above this is obviously NOT the case and my assumption is seriously flawed both for Woody and probably many others. I tend to post and view all over the place and my assumption was that others were just like me (pretty dumb assumption really).

Same goes for meets. Someone could attend 100 meets at birddog's and never once have a serious play with a tripod or a monopod until they have a need to investigate it. Same goes for more exoitic stuff like plucka's underwater housing.

Thanks Woody for giving me the opportunity to reskew/unskew my assumptions for the future. I'm sorry this has frustrated you so much, but hopefully others, too, can reflect on the way others use the forum and avoid similar frustrations for others in the future.

[Glen]

Woody, no one expects you have to read every thread or post. I think the point is a new person only can put the word monopod in search, and will get answers like "I took this photo with my 70-200 and monopod". A member who has been here a while would be aware that any tripod or monopod discussion would include the products made by Arsene Gitzhoven or Lino Manfrotto's companies as well as others. So then the member could search by monopod and manfrotto and get useful info.

Maybe if a member posted a question such as "I am thinking of buying a monopod, spending $X- $Y, have been thinking about X, Y and Z, does anyone have opinions or any others I should consider?" It might get a more favourable response.

ps I admire your effort to consolidate the monopod info, but the first three questions sort of confuses that and in all honesty would have taken some time to answer properly. At the same time you were writing this I was trying to do the same thing for lens reviews, http://forum.d70users.com/viewtopic.php ... da9f0e748d

[W00DY]

Let's just finish this thread here

It is becoming more frustrating watching this forum move form a nice little village to a bustling city (still nice though) but obviously this was always going to happen.

I will use the search function more often and let's hope that when new members do post questions we all give them the answers that we have written 20 - 30 times (or post a link).

Hope I have not rubbed anyone up the wrong way by this thread... Must be having a bad day

W00DY

[stubbsy]

Hope I have not rubbed anyone up the wrong way by this thread... Must be having a bad day

Woody - Do families ever have disagreeements? Sure do - it's a healthy thing and healthier still when there's discussion about them.

I don't have a problem with anything that's been said here. Now if this was a flame war it would be entirely different, but everybody's been pretty adult here.

And can I make a "getting back to the topic" suggestion. When you finally make your decision can you come back and post what you decided and why, since that too would be useful info.

[goodrich62]

No Monopod will replace the stability of a trypod
That being said speed of set up is an issue. I have a Manfroto tripod I got for my telescope and it is great for Macro and sit and wait shots. But for walking around shots by the time I set up the target was gone.
I got a Manfroto 682 monopod it has a tripod foot that scews into the bottom that gives almost the stability of a tripod with the quick setup of a monopod and it makes a good walking stick
Medically I need to walk if I could set up a blind and wait I would always use a tripod. I the 682 is not the best of both worlds but it comes close for me

[W00DY]

When you finally make your decision can you come back and post what you decided and why, since that too would be useful info.

I am really torn regarding this...

I think I need both Of course the finances won't allow that though. I like the idea of the monopod as it is easy to carry / easy to use, but I am concerned about the shots I would miss using it.

Anyway I will have a good think about it and make a decision soon. I'll probably go with a mono to start with and then a tripod later down the line.

W00DY

[Glen]

Woody, the one useful piece of advice I can give is don't buy junk. Decide where you want to end up and with what products, then either buy the item you will use most first or buy second hand and buy both. Good luck

[MCWB]

Interesting discussion on both fronts guys!

With respect to the monopod/tripod/lens/$$$ question, I think Glen's advice is spot on. Most of us have finite $ to spend on our hobbies, so it's a matter of priorities. Having seen what the limitations of cheap tripods are, I'm convinced of the need to spend heavily on good legs and a good ballhead, however both these are useless if you don't have the glass you want to shoot with.

With that in mind, I think I'll be purchasing glass first, then monopod when the glass would benefit from it, then good tripod legs/head when I can justify the money.

[Nicole]

Hi Woody. When I am using my VR lens I rarely (if ever) use my tripod. I use my monopod. However, if I am using the kit lens for long exposures or using my macro lens I almost always use the tripod. When i travelled overseas i took both with me and 99.9% of the time used the monopod or went handheld as the monopod was lighter and more portable. I don't have a carbon fibre tripod so lugging the tripod long distances in the rainforest was not appealing.

It's a tough decision and you really need to look at what you're mostly taking photos of if your budget doesn't allow for both. If your subjects are likely to move quickly (i.e. birds, animals etc.), you've got VR lenses and you prefer to travel lighter then you're probably better off with the monopod.

[W00DY]

Hi Woody. When I am using my VR lens I rarely (if ever) use my tripod. I use my monopod. However, if I am using the kit lens for long exposures or using my macro lens I almost always use the tripod. When i travelled overseas i took both with me and 99.9% of the time used the monopod or went handheld as the monopod was lighter and more portable. I don't have a carbon fibre tripod so lugging the tripod long distances in the rainforest was not appealing.

It's a tough decision and you really need to look at what you're mostly taking photos of if your budget doesn't allow for both. If your subjects are likely to move quickly (i.e. birds, animals etc.), you've got VR lenses and you prefer to travel lighter then you're probably better off with the monopod.

Hi Nicole,

This is excactly what I was thinking. Thanks for your reply.

I think I am leaning towards this rather than a tripod.

W00DY

[Killakoala]

A monopod that is sturdy should be what youare after. I have the Manfrotto 680B, which is a three section monopod, is quick to set up and because it's 3 sections it has a shorter profile when packed up.

It's also aluminium and is heavy enough to be easily used as an offensive weapon if required, but is not too heavy to carry around.

Also a good idea regardelss of what brand of monpod you buy is to get the Manfrotto 234 monopod head that will allow up and down movement. It is extremely useful and you'll wonder how you could have used a monopod without one. They only cost about ~30 Aussie dollars.

[birddog114]

Hi Woody. When I am using my VR lens I rarely (if ever) use my tripod. I use my monopod.

Nicole,
Are you talking about 24-120VR? 80-400Vr, 70-200VR or 200-400VR?
Apart from the last three lenses, I agreed to use monopod in some cases, but does anyone use the 24-120VR or 18-70 on a monopod?

[W00DY]

A monopod that is sturdy should be what youare after. I have the Manfrotto 680B, which is a three section monopod, is quick to set up and because it's 3 sections it has a shorter profile when packed up.

It's also aluminium and is heavy enough to be easily used as an offensive weapon if required, but is not too heavy to carry around.

Also a good idea regardelss of what brand of monpod you buy is to get the Manfrotto 234 monopod head that will allow up and down movement. It is extremely useful and you'll wonder how you could have used a monopod without one. They only cost about ~30 Aussie dollars.

Yeah this is the one I would probably look at. Seem sto be well priced. I do want to check out the Neotec (I think that is the name) though.

Birdy - I would be using the 24-120 VR on the monopod most of the time. At the moment I can get a good sharp image around 1/20th with the VR so hopefully a monopod will increase the shutter signifigantly.

W00DY

[Nicole]

Birddog I use the 80-400VR on my monopod no problems. I haven't used the 70-200 so couldn't comment there but I agree that I would definitely not be using the 200-400 on the monopod. Then again you do see those guys at the sporting events with the telephoto lenses on the monopods. When I am using the 80-400 on the monopod I try and rest it against something else for extra stability. I think before the next trip though i'll be getting one of those Kinesis sacks.

Personally I don't use the 18-70 on my monopod so i would have to agree with you there. I have only used it on the tripod for long exposures after sunset.

[Onyx]

I have the Manfrotto 680B, which is a three section monopod, is quick to set up and because it's 3 sections it has a shorter profile when packed up.

Killa, the 680B is a 4 section 'pod. It has 3 clips, 4 leg sections. The 681B is the 3 section one (it has 2 clips). The two side by side (your 680B on the right):

[birddog114]

Birddog I use the 80-400VR on my monopod no problems. I haven't used the 70-200 so couldn't comment there but I agree that I would definitely not be using the 200-400 on the monopod. Then again you do see those guys at the sporting events with the telephoto lenses on the monopods. When I am using the 80-400 on the monopod I try and rest it against something else for extra stability. I think before the next trip though i'll be getting one of those Kinesis sacks.

Personally I don't use the 18-70 on my monopod so i would have to agree with you there. I have only used it on the tripod for long exposures after sunset.

Nicole,

It's correct answer! the monopod is only suitable for photo lens as the 80-400/ 70-200/ 200-400/ 4,5,600mm telephoto lenses, When you can’t use a tripod, a monopod is the best alternative. A monopod is much more stable than any sort of shoulder stock (though not quite so fast to aim). Monopods are compact, easy to transport, and unobtrusive in use. Shooting off of a monopod makes stalking wildlife with a long lens a lot easier than from a tripod. You’ll get off more shots, and—with fast shutter speeds, proper technique, and practice—you’ll get a good yield of keepers; verify with any sports photographer

Any lens less than 200mm or no lens collar, monopod will be useless or created more problems as blurring, soft image then handholding. The problem of the monopod with short lens or lens without lens collar is the camera body will be mounted on the monopod, therefore no balancing with the body and lens and hard to control both monopod and camera with one hand for steady while composing. Because monopod shooting demands fast shutter speeds—preferably 1/500th sec. or faster—don’t use some slow zoom that only gets to f5.6 when it’s wide open. Shoot at f4, or faster.

Any lens less than 200mm, the best way is to use the tripod in slower or longer shutter speed or handholding if possible, again, long lens without tripod collar may create vibration and non sturdy, 12-24, 17-55, 18-35,18-70, 24-120 or 28-200 are ideal to use with tripod rather than monopod.

[W00DY]

[quote="Birddog114"]

Any lens less than 200mm or no lens collar, monopod will be useless or created more problems as blurring, soft image then handholding. The problem of the monopod with short lens or lens without lens collar is the camera body will be mounted on the monopod, therefore no balancing with the body and lens and hard to control both tripod and camera with one hand for steady while composing. Because monopod shooting demands fast shutter speeds—preferably 1/500th sec. or faster—don’t use some slow zoom that only gets to f5.6 when it’s wide open. Shoot at f4, or faster.

[quote]

Birdy,

I don't really understand this can you (or someone else) explain more.

I thought a monopod was pretty successful in stopping any vertical camera movement. Now I also thought you sort of wrap your body around the monopod (would this not give body support?).

You say it is hard to balance the tripod (did you mean monopod?) and camera with one hand. What is your other hand doing? wouldn't you still be holding the camera the same way?

I am not sure how using a monopod can cause worse images when handholding with slower shutter speeds?

I must be missing something here?

W00DY

[birddog114]

Any lens less than 200mm or no lens collar, monopod will be useless or created more problems as blurring, soft image then handholding. The problem of the monopod with short lens or lens without lens collar is the camera body will be mounted on the monopod, therefore no balancing with the body and lens and hard to control both tripod and camera with one hand for steady while composing. Because monopod shooting demands fast shutter speeds—preferably 1/500th sec. or faster—don’t use some slow zoom that only gets to f5.6 when it’s wide open. Shoot at f4, or faster.

Birdy,

I don't really understand this can you (or someone else) explain more.

I thought a monopod was pretty successful in stopping any vertical camera movement. Now I also thought you sort of wrap your body around the monopod (would this not give body support?).

You say it is hard to balance the tripod (did you mean monopod?) and camera with one hand. What is your other hand doing? wouldn't you still be holding the camera the same way?

I am not sure how using a monopod can cause worse images when handholding with slower shutter speeds?

I must be missing something here?

W00DY

That's the techniques of shooting with monopod, slower shutter speed is not work with monopod btw.
You have one hand wrap around monopod, one hand hold the camera with the index finger on the shutter release, which hand are you going to use the zoom ring?.
The long lens or telephoto lens is giving you more balancing of the camera and body, cos it mount on the lens collar instead of the body, as Nicole said;"try and rest it against something else for extra stability", she has the 80-400VR.

[W00DY]

You have one hand wrap around tripod, one hand hold the camera with the index finger on the shutter release, which hand are you going to use the zoom ring?.

See, this is where I get confused as I thought you used your leg to support the monopod and then you have two free hands to work the camera (as normal).

I get your point about the longer lenses and lens collars, that is very true.

W00DY

[phillipb]

I've never used a monopod so I'm not really qualified to reply, but don't you still only have two hands when you use a monopod with long lens?
1 hand on the monopod one on the camera and you still have to find another hand for the zoom.
Maybe monopods are only good for prime lenses.

[birddog114]

I've never used a monopod so I'm not really qualified to reply, but don't you still only have two hands when you use a monopod with long lens?
1 hand on the monopod one on the camera and you still have to find another hand for the zoom.
Maybe monopods are only good for prime lenses.

Yes, that what I meant, with a long lens, it's difference, one hand on the lens'barrel and the other hand to have at the camera body with finger index on the release button.

On the shorter lens like 18-70/ 24-120/ 50mm or 70-300, your play

[Glen]

Woody, have thought on your situation, why dont you buy a monopod to see if you like them, they can be had for a modest price for a quality item, and a tabletop tripod for your long exposure shots (Gary has one, by Manfrotto, quite cheap, maybe $50, listed on Vanbar site). The tabletop tripod is only temporary as you need to find a table or similar or take your shots 200mm from the ground as it is small (200mm high) and is of great use down the line because of its size. Good luck