What to do? D70 purchase with pre-existing Nikon equipment..

[bochup]

Hi guys, (and gals of course)

I'm a photography newbie looking to purchase a D70 and since you guys are the area experts I thought I'll ask for your expert opinions on what D70 purchase to make. This camera will probably be shared between my dad and me for now.

I'm tossing up between just a plain D70 body or one of those Lens kits (especially since they have that $200 discount going on)

Now the spin on this is that my dad already has alot of Nikon lens gear for his Nikon F501 SLR.

He already has the following lenses:
* 35-135mm f3.5-4.5 AF Nikkor
* 80-200mm f2.8 ED Nikkor
* 24mm f2.8 Wide Angle

So what to do?

Option A) Get a camera body only OR
Option B) Is the extra lens worth the extra dole (considering the $200 cashback). If so, which lens kit is good considering the lenses I've already got?

Now i've read that these film SLR lenses can already be mounted on the D70.

Also read that with the older lenses for film SLRs the ?length? of the lens changes when mounted on a DSLR because the CCD area is smaller than the film capture area is this true?

Thanks! PS. My first post here. woohoo!

[Glen]

Welcome Bochup, in your position I would get the kit lens (18-70DX) as it gives you a wide angle and AFS (very fast autofocussing) and costs bugger all, compared to its value, in the kit. The other lenses are excellent. Remember that there is a crop factor on Nikon digital of 1.5, so the 35-135 will behave like 52.5 -202.5, so you can see the benefit of the 18-70.

Welcome and good luck[/b]

[johndec]

Welcome to the forum bochup, 3 weeks a member and this is only your first post? Don't be shy, we are one big family here

First of all, this is not a reply from an "expert", but I'll muddle through your questions anyway


Your old man has some nice glass which will take fine pics with the D70 (which we expect to see very soon), but I would recommend getting the D70 with the 18-70mm kit lens. Why, you ask. Well firstly, the 18-70 is a pretty good lens and bloody cheap when bundled with the body. Secondly, this lens will give you a wider field of view than any of Dad's lenses. This becomes even more important when you consider that (to answer your other question) the focal length is magnified by the smaller sensor of the D70 compared to a 35mm film body.

I wont go into the details of "crop factor" here, do a search on this forum about it or PM Killakoala (our resident crop factor expert) and he will send you a 37 page thesis on the subject , but in a nutshell Nikon DSLR's have a 1.5 lens magnification. So Dad's 24mm will behave like a 36mm lens on the D70. Likewise the 80-200 will be like a 120-300 compared to the F501. Hence you can see that an 18mm lens can come in handy for a digital Nikon

Hope this helps and don't forget to post the first pic you take with the D70...

[bochup]

Guys, firstly, thanks for the replies! Also thanks for the welcome and enthusiasm.

johndec: First pic with the camera would probably be badly out of focus, haven't really handled many SLRs. Are you sure you want it? hehe.

i'll look into the 18-70mm lens kit. I assume that this lens with it's wider angle won't be for close-ups?

With the existing lenses i have the extra 1.5 magnification that should make them better for close-ups yeah? Also these lenses have ?macro? functions on them?

Has anyone used macro functions designed for film SLRs on a DSLR? Is there a difference?

Reason I ask is that my old man and myself are abit into the close-up photography side of things as well.

Apologies if this all sounds confusing trying to get my head around these terms/technical issues etc.

By the way what's with the big Nikon following? It seems to me that Nikon users are much more active than other SLR users...like Fuji or Pentax or even Canon?

Cheers

[Geoff]

Hello bochup and welcome (again!). The other guys have (as usual) answered your questions beautifully but I would like to re iterate that you can't go wrong with the kit lens and as the others have said it is REALLY quite cheap when bundled with the D70! Where abouts are you from? It might be useful for you to put your area/suburb in your profile so that we know where u are and that kinda stuff. It's quite useful to everyone else on the forum, i.e you may live just around the corner from one of the many gurus here so he/she may be able to meet up with you and show you a thing or two with your new camera! Keep on posting and remember no question is a stupid question. We look forward to your posts and images! As for the kit lens and macro - definately not, but I will allow one of the more knowledgeable macro users fill you in on this. Cheers!


Geoff

[Glen]

Hi Bochup, the kit lens doesn't have macro and though I don't have the 35-135, I don't believe any of yours do either. Some lenses offer macro as an add on, though Nikon doesn't really do this. For real macro best to buy a dedicated unit, either Nikon 60 or 105mm or Sigma 105, Tamron 90, etc are well spoken of.


Here is the link to Nikon macros: http://www.maxwell.com.au/products/niko ... index.html



Good luck

[birddog114]

bochup,
Welcome! you better get the full kit camera and lens rather than buy a body only, cost saving and giving you more use in wide angle same as other aspects wth the kit lens 18-70.
Your 35-135 is an old lens and won't give you much in quality and what you need with the DSLR.
The 80-200/ 2.8 is the one of among Nikon gems and its range has 3 difference versions, which one do you have?
The 28/2.8 is a so so WA lens, and still giving you good shots in low light but it's not an excellent on the crop factor of DSLR.

[gstark]

Hi, Bochup, and welcome.

You say that we're the "area experts' but I don't know about that, especially as you don't tell us where you are. Please put your locality into your profile. Believe it or not, it'll make your stay here just that much more valuable.

Let's look at a few of your questions....

I'm tossing up between just a plain D70 body or one of those Lens kits (especially since they have that $200 discount going on)

Some of the dealers around town will offer different lenses as "kit" lenses. Don't be fooled by sly shucksters. The only lens that is the kit lens is the 18-70mm AF DX AS. If you want to buy it separately, it's around $500 - $600, but buying it in a kit with the body only adds $200 to the body price. Subtract the rebate of $200 and that means that it's ... free.

Lenses like the 28-80 that some dealers will try and throw at you are very cheap glass, don't attract the rebate, and probably cost less than the extra the dealers want you to pay when they bundle it as a kit.

And if the lens they're offering in a bundle is not a Nikkor ... sit down on the floor in the middle of the store and start crying - very loudly - 'cos they're really trying to rip you off.

Now the spin on this is that my dad already has alot of Nikon lens gear for his Nikon F501 SLR.

He already has the following lenses:
* 35-135mm f3.5-4.5 AF Nikkor
* 80-200mm f2.8 ED Nikkor
* 24mm f2.8 Wide Angle

OK, I still have a heap of lenses for my old 35mm stuff, including the 24mm 2.8 as well. Nice glass.

The decision is a difficult one, but the bottom line is that the kit lens is excellent value - basically too good a deal to pass up.

Especially when someone else is paying for it for you.

The only alternative to the kit lens that I might suggest would be the 24-120 VR, which I bought in August.

It and my D70 body have become almost inseparable partners since then, and while it's also a very good buy and an excellent walk-around lens, I think the freebie status of the 18-70 helps this decision make itself.

So what to do?

Option A) Get a camera body only OR
Option B) Is the extra lens worth the extra dole (considering the $200 cashback). If so, which lens kit is good considering the lenses I've already got?

See my comments above. No matter what the salespeople tell you, there is only one kit lens.

Now i've read that these film SLR lenses can already be mounted on the D70.

Also read that with the older lenses for film SLRs the ?length? of the lens changes when mounted on a DSLR because the CCD area is smaller than the film capture area is this true?

There's a few things that you need to understand here, and it'll take a few days for you to completely get your head around this, so don't worry or get upset about being confudes about all of this.

Nikon film cameras produce a full frame 35mm film image. Open up the back of your dad's 501 (make sure there's no film in it first) and you'll see a recangular cutout area in the middle. That's where the light comes through from the lens when the shutter is open.

That area, by the way, is about an inch high by about an inch and a half wide, and the lenses that your dad has will fully cover that area, thus providing an image with which the film can be exposed.

Nikon's digital cameras use an electronic sensor instead of film, and that sensor is somewhat smaller than the size of the area you've just seen on the film camera, and thus, any 35mm image that you might have seen is effectively missing a small portion around all of its edges.

The resulting image is effectively "cropped", and this is what is called the "crop factor" on digital cameras. Most other dSLRs also share this phenomenon to some degree.

Nikon's crop factor is around 1.5x, and this means that, relative to a 35mm film image, to get the same sized photo you are enalarging the image (as exposed on the sensor) by around 1.5.

This is very similar to having lenses that are 1.5 longer than their stated focal length, but not quite, because you're (for instance) losing a lot of information that's been cropped out from the edges.

That is exactly how all of your dad's lenses will behave, btw.


Because of this crop factor, Nikon have developed a new series of lenses, and these are marked as DX. By taking different design decisions, they've been able to eliminate this "wasted" light. This makes the lenses smaller and lighter, and less expensive.

Although they will give similar performance to your dad's film camera lenses on the D70, they're not designed to work on the film cameras. You need to be aware of this, but it's nothing to be concerned about.

[kipper]

Bochup listen to Birddog, he's the master. Also look at going through him for your camera and lense. He'll do you a great price on it. I've just ordered $2800 worth of lense through him

Plus plan to order another equally as big order for some legs.

[the foto fanatic]

I also agree that the kit lens is worthwhile.
In your case, it'll give you a wider angle than the existing glass will.
I happen to think that the 18-70DX is a brilliant match for the D70, and I still use it most, even with an array of other lenses.

[MATT]

Welcome bochup,

I agree wiht most , the kit lense is a fine piece for the price included with the kit.

I will however when funds permit, get a 24-120 VR as my walk around.

I think its great that you have a range of lenses from your dad that you can play with.

Get the kit lense, play with the others then buy the right lense for you

enjoy the forum

MATT

[bochup]

Guys am I wrong to choose the 24-120VR lens over the 18-70mm?

I've read reviews and specs and this lens seems to be a great lens for 'daily' use. Also a good lens for travelling since you can use this one lens instead of 2 or 3 others.

So at the moment it looks like a D70 body with a 24-120VR lens to be purchased later. It'll cost more but heck it seems like the quality choice.

Now to find some cash

[xorl]

Guys am I wrong to choose the 24-120VR lens over the 18-70mm?

I've read reviews and specs and this lens seems to be a great lens for 'daily' use. Also a good lens for travelling since you can use this one lens instead of 2 or 3 others.

So at the moment it looks like a D70 body with a 24-120VR lens to be purchased later. It'll cost more but heck it seems like the quality choice.

As everyone else has said, the 18-70mm is pretty much a "must have" when purchasing a D70 body. It is an excellent lense and it's the cheapest way to take decent wide angle photos with the D70. The RRP for the lense in Aus is $700. You get it for less than half of that when buying it with a D70. If you don't get it with the body you will need to spend a lot more to take wide angle photos with your D70.

It's so good I'd probably get another 18-70mm if I bought a 2nd D70 body.

[birddog114]

Guys am I wrong to choose the 24-120VR lens over the 18-70mm?

I've read reviews and specs and this lens seems to be a great lens for 'daily' use. Also a good lens for travelling since you can use this one lens instead of 2 or 3 others.

So at the moment it looks like a D70 body with a 24-120VR lens to be purchased later. It'll cost more but heck it seems like the quality choice.

As everyone else has said, the 18-70mm is pretty much a "must have" when purchasing a D70 body. It is an excellent lense and it's the cheapest way to take decent wide angle photos with the D70. The RRP for the lense in Aus is $700. You get it for less than half of that when buying it with a D70. If you don't get it with the body you will need to spend a lot more to take wide angle photos with your D70.

It's so good I'd probably get another 18-70mm if I bought a 2nd D70 body.

Yes, the 18-70 is good in some certain point, if you have tried the 24-120VR then you may changed your mind.
You can buy the 18-70 in Sydney around $400.00 new or $200-$300 used.
While the 24-120VR is $1200.00 at Vanbar or more at other stores.
Or buy grey 24-120VR at $750.00. Grey 18-70 = $390.00

[stubbsy]

bochup

Not much to add to the great advice you've already been given, but remember if you buy the body only you don't get the $200 rebate. As has been said already body + 18-70 Dx - $200 = body alone (almost) making the lens (almost) free!

[birddog114]

Stubbsy,
You're right!
Unless you buy grey: D70 + 24-120VR.

[xorl]

Yes, the 18-70 is good in some certain point, if you have tried the 24-120VR then you may changed your mind.
You can buy the 18-70 in Sydney around $400.00 new or $200-$300 used.
While the 24-120VR is $1200.00 at Vanbar or more at other stores.
Or buy grey 24-120VR at $750.00. Grey 18-70 = $390.00

True.. If I had the 12-24mm (Mmmmm...) to cover the wide angle I'd find the 24-120 a lot more interesting. Usually I can put the 18-70mm on a tripod to stabilise if I have to when taking photos, I can't make the 24-120 go wider .

[nigels]

Hello Bochup,

Agree with all thats been said, and don't even think about buying the body without the kit lens.

Great lens, virtually free after the $200 cash back.

Don't worry about being shy, I myself feel very humble and and feel backward in offering advice with so many excellent and dedicated photogs in the forum, when I am definitely a newbe in the photography arena. The guys and gals on the forum are a great group of people who will freely give their time and knowledge to those of us who need help or advice.

Welcome to the forum, and we all look forward to your posts in the future

regards
Nige