First attempt at 'macro' photography

[johnmc]

Hi all,

here's a couple of shots from my first attempt at 'macro' photography, using my "new" eos 10D (yeah I know they are far from new - but it's my first digital slr).

The shots were taken with a Canon 28-80mm lens with a macro lens (screw-on like a filter) attached mounted on my trusty old tripod. Lighting is just natural daylight. I'm thinking I should have used my 50mm lens as it's a 1:1.4 rather than the other being a 1:3.5-5.6 - isn't hindsight a wonderful thing!?

I'm looking for any advice (more from a technical than creative as I was focusing more on familiarising myself with technique than image composition) on how these could be improved. I'm also keen to hear opinions on other macro techniques such as reversed lenses, coupled reversed lenses and extension tubes (don't have the budget for a true 1:1 lens at the moment).

So thanks in advance and I look forward to spending more time in these forums.





Images link to full resolution versions if you want to see more detail

Cheers,

John

[Mr Darcy]

For your first go, these are pretty darned good.
However, the 1.4 will probably not help much. The wider you open your lens, the narrower the depth of field. At macro distances, f1.4 will probably give you significantly less than 1mm in focus.
You generally want to stop down to f8 or more in macro work. I routinely go below f22.
Though If you are planning to use the f1.4 at these apertures, it may well help quality as fast prime lenses are generally better optically than kit lenses.
Then of course you need to boost light levels. Enter flash. sigh.

[biggerry]

Enter flash. sigh.

yes and the onboard flash does not cut the mustard. sign.

I do not have any experience with reveresed lens, but I picked up a couple of macro lens off fleabay quite cheap, if you are on a budget and this is an option, take a look at the old skool manual ones, I know, in the nikon world, there are plenty of old manual focus macros going for less than 200 bucks or so. Also, have you considered hiring a lens for a weekend?

Anyway probably a little off track but just a thought.

f8 or more in macro work. I routinely go below f22.

I agree, this wil make a world of difference in terms of gettign enough dof. Most importantly keep trying and post 'em up.

[gstark]

here's a couple of shots from my first attempt at 'macro' photography, using my "new" eos 10D (yeah I know they are far from new - but it's my first digital slr).

Still a good camera, and a great tool for you to start with.

I agree that the 50 may have been better for these, but while you do have f/1.4, when you're shooting wide open, and epecially at close distances like these, your DoF will be very, very shallow. That will make focusing very critical for you.

Presuming that the ant is your primary subject, you probably want to try to get a little closer to it so that it fills the frame more.

Welcome, btw, and please keep on shooting and posting.

[johnmc]

Thanks for all the tips guys...

I'll give things another shot next weekend (time through the week is a bit limited).

Think I'll experiment a bit more between my lenses - in particular giving the 50mm a go as it's a pretty sweet lens

I've looked through the various softbox concepts for the speedlite flashes (I have a 420ex) and think this will be a must for these sort of shots so I can shoot with a less open aperature.

Quick question - as I mentioned before these were taken with a 'Mandee' brand screw-on macro converter lens (you know - the ones that attach like a filter to the end of the lens) - would I be better of sticking with this (only using it as it's what I have on hand) or looking at extension tubes?

Admitedly I'd like to get hold of a good macro lens - but think I should improve on my skills first - and I am going to give that lens reversal concept a go - if nothing else it sounds like a bit of (albeit frustrating) fun!

Will keep you posted on my progress - and thanks again.

John

[colin_12]

Hello John, and welcome.
I would advocate extension tubes over the screw in filter efforts. That said I have seen some cool work with both.
The only reason I have ever reversed a lens was to get more working distance when using ext rings. some lenses do not perform as well reversed, more research for you to do.
A 90mm tamron macro is only around twice the price of a set of auto ext tubes. Tubes do however let you use any of your lenes to try this work.
I use some really small f stops (f 45ish) to help attain depth. Depth versus clarity is a two edged sword though as most lenses start to loose clarity after around f 11 to 16 ish. Check out ATJ's and Rel's work,as well as heaps of others here.
Hope this helps,

[Mr Darcy]

I've played a bit with reversed lenses, tubes and macro lenses. I don't recall ever playing with macro "filters" as you are using though.

I've had very good results with reversed lenses, though as commented, it works better with some lenses than others. In my experience, it works better with primes than zoom lenses. My best results were with a 120mm on the camera (a Pentax Spotmatic) and a 55mm reversed on it. Both were SMC Takumar lenses. Also while gaffer tape worked, a reversing ring worked a whole lot better.

I have nothing but praise for the extension tube method. Relatively cheap, and you are not adding any more glass (and possible distortions/flare) to the mix. You can also use them with any lens (including a macro lens!), so as you upgrade your lenses, you also upgrade your macro capability. I use and recommend the Kenko Tubes.

The ultimate is, of course, a dedicated macro lens. Remember though that you don't tend to use autofocus for macro work so one of the older MF lenses can be extremely good value for money. I use a 105AF VR (IS in Canon speak) and switch off both VR and AF when using it for macro work. They both go on when I use it as a short Telephoto.
When you do take this step, you need to consider what you are taking. If it is mostly stamps and coins a short (say 60mm) macro is the way to go. If you want to take photos of funnelwebs, you would be better off with a 200mm (or more!) macro. In my case, I was after a candid portrait lens as well as a macro lens. That alternate use pushed me towards the 105.

HTH

[aim54x]

I have used the Marumi close up filter set (Macro filter set) on my 50mm f/1.8 and have been quite pleased with the results. They are the cheapest and nastiest way to get to macro photography but will not get you 1:1 reproduction, nor will they be very good for larger DOF. By adding glass elements to the front of your lens you are automatically reducing the image quality...

I have gone the way for a long macro (Sigma 180mm f/3.5) and it does double duty as a telephoto prime when I dont carry my 70-200mm VR.

[ATJ]

Screw in lenses (usually called diopters) will work and can work quite well. They more or less do the same job as an extension tube with the benefit of less loss of light, but the disadvantage of adding more glass. If that glass is not as optically good as the lens, you will degrade the quality of the optics. An extension tube has no glass and so has no impact on optical quality. I regularly use diopters for my underwater photography where space inside a port is limited and the quality (of good ones) is excellent.

[big pix]

....... nice images with contrast and purpose. The busy flower and the black ant work very well, the reduced size does not help the image at all......... the first works a treat,print it big and see it all come together

[aim54x]

I regularly use diopters for my underwater photography where space inside a port is limited and the quality (of good ones) is excellent.

Which ones do you use??

[johnmc]

Thanks again for all the advise guys... I can't wait to have a good play once I figure a way to reduce the harshness of my flash.

I had a quick toy tonight to familiarize myself more with the existing gear - sample shot can be seen below, shot with the flash bouncing of a sheet of white paper to the RHS of the stage.(once again click to view full size) - any comments appreciated (once again not focusing on compositing the shot so much, but rather getting a reasonable depth of field and some better exposure).

[ATJ]

I regularly use diopters for my underwater photography where space inside a port is limited and the quality (of good ones) is excellent.

Which ones do you use??

B+W. I mainly use +4 or +5. +4 results in the same maximum magnification underwater in a 6" dome port as you would get with the bare lens above water.

[aim54x]

Very nice work with the coffee beans, could almost be used as a background/mural for a coffee shop! great to hear that you have kept playing with what you have, it is often the case where we jsut want to rush out and buy the next bit of gear.

I regularly use diopters for my underwater photography where space inside a port is limited and the quality (of good ones) is excellent.

Which ones do you use??

B+W. I mainly use +4 or +5. +4 results in the same maximum magnification underwater in a 6" dome port as you would get with the bare lens above water.

Thanks!

[johnmc]

Thanks aim54x...

Mastering the equipment I have is something I learnt by starting my photogaphic hobby with a Pentax P30n - all manual slr - with the cost of getting films processed it was even more critical than this 'new fandangled digital stuff'.

Once I'm comfortable with the gear I'll then start to look more at lighting and composition - the best tips I've ever picked up have been from professional photographers (I worked with many of them as a graphic designer for years), it's always great to watch and pickup any little tricks you can. I'd like to get out on some group outings at some stage to pick up (and hopefully share some of my own) a few tips, but a full time job and 3 young kids does tend to reduce my availability.

Thanks again for the compliments and advice everyone - I'm glad to have found a good community such as this

Cheers

John

[aim54x]

Thanks aim54x...

no worries

Mastering the equipment I have is something I learnt by starting my photogaphic hobby with a Pentax P30n - all manual slr - with the cost of getting films processed it was even more critical than this 'new fandangled digital stuff'.

I know what you mean, I still shoot film, and like yourself learnt on fully manual Nikon FM's and Pentax K1000's, I now own a FM2n and a F80D which I would love to take out more often...esp with FM2n but I am still looking for a good MF lens for this body.

I'd like to get out on some group outings at some stage to pick up (and hopefully share some of my own) a few tips, but a full time job and 3 young kids does tend to reduce my availability.

There are quite a few member meets that happen, if you keep an eye out for other members that are local to you then you may be able to organise something to suit your busy lifestyle.

cheers
Cameron