D800 official announcement in 3 ... 2 ...

[gstark]

The usual rumour sites are ablaze with the imminent announcement (rumoured, of course) of the 36MP Nikon D800.

The official announcement seems to have been leaked by a Brazillian PR firm from where it has been published, and then withdrawn.

Nikon announces tomorrow (7) the D800, its new DSLR camera with 36.3 megapixels of resolution with full-frame sensor. The new model succeeds the Nikon D700 and is a sort of younger sister into account the high-end Nikon D3X.

To our English readers: Nikon Brazil has sent us a message telling That They Made a mistake (actually, Their PR agency did in a personalized e-mail message) and we'll return the official info back online in less then 2.5 hours , When the supposed embargo will fall (and Notified ZTOP was not about that).

Gentlemen, start your sensors.

[aim54x]

Im not sure I want a 36MP D800...but the rumours of a D800E (sans AA filter) look interesting...I may consider this version (if it exists) as long as the D800 outperforms the D7000 in ISO performance. I may grab a D700 on runout though......it seems to suit my desires better.

[Reschsmooth]

I may grab a D700 on runout though......it seems to suit my desires better.

I have seen it mentioned a number of times that the D700 is not expected to fall in price dramatically, apart from 2nd hand gear. I think this relates to the purported differences between the D800 (as rumoured) and the D700.

[aim54x]

I may grab a D700 on runout though......it seems to suit my desires better.

I have seen it mentioned a number of times that the D700 is not expected to fall in price dramatically, apart from 2nd hand gear. I think this relates to the purported differences between the D800 (as rumoured) and the D700.

The D700 has been reported as DISCONTINUED several times, if this is true then retailers with stock on hand will be trying to dump them quickly despite the differences (certain places were offering silly pricing on current models over the xmas period even when there was no stock....so a discontinued model would certainly be slashed by these guys)....and there is always good quality 2nd hand (I know a few people that may upgrade and sell off their lightly used D700's).

[aim54x]

Please dont burst my bubble regarding lower D700 prices!

[Reschsmooth]

Please dont burst my bubble regarding lower D700 prices!

What I meant to say was that I hear that new but discontinued stock of D700s are likely to sell for about $1,200 any time now. [Hey, we are going to be in the market for a new D700 sometime soon as well]. But I just picked up a c56MP* camera yesterday for $150!





*Ok, exposed negs would require 4000dpi scanning!

[aim54x]

$1,200 any time now. [Hey, we are going to be in the market for a new D700 sometime soon as well]. But I just picked up a c56MP* camera yesterday for $150!

*Ok, exposed negs would require 4000dpi scanning!

Nice work....what camera?

[Reschsmooth]

$1,200 any time now. [Hey, we are going to be in the market for a new D700 sometime soon as well]. But I just picked up a c56MP* camera yesterday for $150!

*Ok, exposed negs would require 4000dpi scanning!

Nice work....what camera?

Bronica ETRSI body - we currently have an ETRS. The primary differences are bulb shutter speed setting, mirror lock-up and TTL flash with the appropriate SCA adaptor, which I have (will go nicely with my Metz). Hopefully this one stays away from Tommy's head

[Alpha_7]

http://nikonrumors.com/2012/02/06/nikon ... ease.aspx/

Some more info here - and some rumours at the D800E might be RRP for $3300 while the D800 (the one with the AA filter) might be $3000 or lower). Seems cheaper then I'd expect Nikon to go, but it would certainly be nice to see it come in cheaply.

[Willy wombat]

I like the strategy of high MPs allow us to use both FX and DX lenses on this body with no real drama.

F stopers put the price closer to $4000
Personally I am hoping for the $3000 tag.
I could also use a cheap D700 - but if I couldnt get one for a $1000 differential I would go with the D800.

Hopfully the D800 will continue to use the same batteries as the D700 so I dont have to carry two types.

[Mr Darcy]

Hopfully the D800 will continue to use the same batteries as the D700 so I dont have to carry two types.

I guess we will know soon, but the info I have seen is that it uses the D7000 battery

[gstark]

And now it's official.

http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/dslr/d800/

Newly developed Nikon FX-format CMOS sensor with 36.3 effective megapixels

Multi-area mode Full HD D-Movie that enables a variety of expressions in two formats

ISO 100 to 6400, expandable to Lo 1 (ISO 50 equivalent) or Hi 2 (ISO 25600 equivalent)

[aim54x]

As is the D800E......no AA filter!!

[Alpha_7]

http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/dslr/d8 ... 00_28p.pdf
Brochure!

And the pricing seems to be on the rumoured 'cheap' side compare to some of the other releases.


Sample images.

http://imaging.nikon.com/lineup/dslr/d800/sample01.htm

[radar]

I guess we will know soon, but the info I have seen is that it uses the D7000 battery

correct, and the battery grip will be able to use AA or the D4 battery.

[Alpha_7]

As is the D800E......no AA filter!!

Cam's sold! Another addition to your expensive collection ???

[radar]

MSRP is $3k in the USA and $3.2K for the D800E

DP Review has preview

[ATJ]

MSRP is $3k in the USA and $3.2K for the D800E

So we're expected to pay more for less...

[Alpha_7]

MSRP is $3k in the USA and $3.2K for the D800E

So we're expected to pay more for less...

Well the way I read it, for the D800E it has the ability to disable the in camera AA filter.

That seems to suggest to me it gives you both options (rather then as you put it, paying for them to leave out a part of the camera). I could be interpreting the information wrong, but that's the impression I got.


*edit!*

So there are a few people that read it as I did that it's an optional on off for the D800E, but others that seem to suggest it's an AA Always off. (which IMHO makes more sense)

[gstark]

MSRP is $3k in the USA and $3.2K for the D800E

So we're expected to pay more for less...

Well the way I read it, for the D800E it has the ability to disable the in camera AA filter.

That seems to suggest to me it gives you both options (rather then as you put it, paying for them to leave out a part of the camera). I could be interpreting the information wrong, but that's the impression I got.


*edit!*

So there are a few people that read it as I did that it's an optional on off for the D800E, but others that seem to suggest it's an AA Always off. (which IMHO makes more sense)

Nikon engineers have developed a unique alternative for those seeking the ultimate in definition. The D800E incorporates an optical filter with all the anti-aliasing properties removed in order to facilitate the sharpest images possible.

This is an ideal tool for photographers who can control light, distance and their subjects to the degree where they can mitigate the occurrence of moiré. Aside from the optical filter, all functions and features are the same as on the D800.

Note: The D800E carries an increased possibility that moiré and false color will appear, compared to the D800. IR cut and antireflective coating properties of the optical filter remain the same with both versions

I'm reading this as being always off, and especially so given the CYA caveat quoted here.

[ATJ]

Gary beat me to it.

"The D800E incorporates an optical filter with all the anti-aliasing properties removed in order to facilitate the sharpest images possible."

If they are removed, they can't be added back in...

[aim54x]

As is the D800E......no AA filter!!

Cam's sold! Another addition to your expensive collection ???

Not sure.....I am still waiting to see what ISO and DR are like on it...I don't need/am not interested in 36MP

[Mr Darcy]

I read it as being physically missing, so Andrew's "pay more for less" is on the face of it correct.
Mind you. This is nothing new. Remember 12" TVs?

[Willy wombat]

Hopfully the D800 will continue to use the same batteries as the D700 so I dont have to carry two types.

I guess we will know soon, but the info I have seen is that it uses the D7000 battery

Damn - Appears to be the EN-EL15 battery

[Alpha_7]

Not a huge fan of the video in a DSLR thing, but the Joy Ride movie is impressive (shows what you can do with a huge budget - lots of cameras, lenses and people power).

http://nikonrumors.com/2012/02/07/joy-r ... -out.aspx/

[Matt. K]

Oh I'm sooo excited! Weeeeeeeee..What? D900? Really!....Weeeeeeeeeeeeeeee...Whaat????.................D950! Weeeeeeeeeeeeee!
I know some folk who are still doing some wonderful things with a D70! Let's keep some perspective on all this folks. Nikon wants our money! What do we want?

[chrisk]

I'm underwhelmed. I also think there will be a fast d800s version coming. 4fps max cuts out all the sports shooters

[surenj]

4fps max cuts out all the sports shooters

isn't this supposed to be a studio camera?

[Wink]

I don't think there will be a D800S. I think they've drawn a clear fork in the road with the D800 and D4.

I think Canon will do the same with the 1DX and 5D MkIII(?)

[sirhc55]

4fps max cuts out all the sports shooters

isn't this supposed to be a studio camera?

Absolutely correct.

[chrisk]

what does "supposed to be a studio camera" mean ? says who ? why ?

[Wink]

I think it means studio work where speed and high ISO aren't required, but image quality and large files are?

[chrisk]

oh sure yeah, i get that. and for me that makes sense if you offer a d800s aswell. like the d3 and d3x. one built for studio and one built for low light speed. if you dont offer the alternative, what does a sports, low light guy do ? pay more than double for a d4 ? doesn't seem right to me. it would make far more sense if they had a d800s sharing the d4 16mp sensor. exactly like the d700 and d3. this is of course what made the dual full bodied Nikon system work. right tool for the right job.

36mb and 4fps seems too much of a studio camera and imho that limits the appeal of the system if your an fx shooter not wanting to go a d4. 4fps is pretty average.

[gstark]

what does a sports, low light guy do ? pay more than double for a d4

Yep.

D4 is the high performance, sports model.

D800 is the studio job, medium format replacement contender, high resolution, fine photography tool.

36mb and 4fps seems too much of a studio camera

Exactly.

36MP is now challenging the MF backs, which are typically crop sensored anyway.

The world is changing.

Again.

[chrisk]

sorry i dont buy that line. the alternative is spend double ? no sale.

[Wink]

Why would one pick the E version over the other?

Sounds like the E version provides cleaner images with more detail. So what's the up side for the AA filtered unit?

[chrisk]

the addition of the AA filter loses some sharpness but it virtually eliminates moire. nikon say that pros using the d800e will recognise situations when moire will be a problem and account for it and if they cant software should fix it. a very different approach to fuji who believe that their sensor design controls moire without using an AA filter. AA filters can be removed from any dslr for around the price difference of the d800 vs the d800e. so any dslr can be "sharper' off the bat if you do it aftermarket. but still have the moire issue. so all nikon did was cut out the middle man and remove it for you and charge you for not adding it ! lol

[radar]

I'm underwhelmed. I also think there will be a fast d800s version coming. 4fps max cuts out all the sports shooters

The serious sport shooters will be using the D4 or even still the D3s. To most sport shooters, the extra features of the D4 are worth the extra money. They don't want to have an add on battery grip, just something else to break, leak, they want longer battery life, etc. They want the better low light and obviously the more fps.

[Reschsmooth]

sorry i dont buy that line. the alternative is spend double ? no sale.

Or buy the D700. Doesn't it provide the ISO and fps performance you need?

[chrisk]

im at a loss as to why somehow overnight with the release of this "studio camera", people who want a great quality low light and fast FX camera must all of a sudden pony up for a d4. that never seemed to be a line of argument prior to this release. im not asking for 12fps. im asking for 6 fps, which is still quite modest and half the frame rate of the d4. serious pro sports shooters will still want 12fps over 6 fps anyway.

[Reschsmooth]

36MP is now challenging the MF backs.

For the older or very base models. Phase one are at 80MP

[chrisk]

sorry i dont buy that line. the alternative is spend double ? no sale.

Or buy the D700. Doesn't it provide the ISO and fps performance you need?

well, as you know i do have a d700. lol and of course it provides what i need. but so did the d80 i used to own. my first car gave me most things i needed aswell. this isnt an argument about "you dont need great equipt to take great photos" yadda yadda yadda. we all get that. wooppee.

its not a crime to want something better, nor is it a crime to be critical of something that appears to me, as a consumer, to be limited in my choices as a system owner.

[sirhc55]

oh sure yeah, i get that. and for me that makes sense if you offer a d800s aswell. like the d3 and d3x. one built for studio and one built for low light speed. if you dont offer the alternative, what does a sports, low light guy do ? pay more than double for a d4 ? doesn't seem right to me. it would make far more sense if they had a d800s sharing the d4 16mp sensor. exactly like the d700 and d3. this is of course what made the dual full bodied Nikon system work. right tool for the right job.

36mb and 4fps seems too much of a studio camera and imho that limits the appeal of the system if your an fx shooter not wanting to go a d4. 4fps is pretty average.

In studio work 1fps is absolutely fine. 4fps is a bonus. This camera emulates its big brothers in having a large sensor and I would rather have a camera dedicated to what I do than one that is jack of all trades.

[chrisk]

oh sure yeah, i get that. and for me that makes sense if you offer a d800s aswell. like the d3 and d3x. one built for studio and one built for low light speed. if you dont offer the alternative, what does a sports, low light guy do ? pay more than double for a d4 ? doesn't seem right to me. it would make far more sense if they had a d800s sharing the d4 16mp sensor. exactly like the d700 and d3. this is of course what made the dual full bodied Nikon system work. right tool for the right job.

36mb and 4fps seems too much of a studio camera and imho that limits the appeal of the system if your an fx shooter not wanting to go a d4. 4fps is pretty average.

In studio work 1fps is absolutely fine. 4fps is a bonus. This camera emulates its big brothers in having a large sensor and I would rather have a camera dedicated to what I do than one that is jack of all trades.

if you want to do studio work buy a hassleblad.

[biggerry]

~20mb per jpg..sheesh i am out...

check out teh detail in the picture of the woman with the veil - you can see her contacts and the tiny bit of makeup on her eye...

[Wink]

It was in the hands of a legend IMO too. Cliff's work blows me away every time I see it.

[Reschsmooth]

sorry i dont buy that line. the alternative is spend double ? no sale.

Or buy the D700. Doesn't it provide the ISO and fps performance you need?

well, as you know i do have a d700. lol and of course it provides what i need. but so did the d80 i used to own. my first car gave me most things i needed aswell. this isnt an argument about "you dont need great equipt to take great photos" yadda yadda yadda. we all get that. wooppee.

its not a crime to want something better, nor is it a crime to be critical of something that appears to me, as a consumer, to be limited in my choices as a system owner.

I do know you have the D700 .

What I am saying us that the D800 being a "studio camera" is like complaining that a new 50 ISO film is hopeless for sports shooter when we already have 400 ISO Tri-x.

That said, the D800 seems to go so far away from the middling DX00s we have seen in the past.

What we may end up seeing is 4 iterations of the 'prosumer' DX00 camera:

Fast frame-rate, moderate MP count camera in both FX and DX format;
Studio high MP count FX and DX camera.

Is that a smart business strategy? Not sure.

[ATJ]

I don't have a problem with the D800 being a specialist camera (e.g. a studio camera) but it seems to have a weird mix of features. For example, why would you need "Advance Scene Recognition" in a studio camera? What does it need to recognise? If you are going to use it to shoot landscapes, what does it need to recognise, especially when you typically have a massive depth of field available? Why does a studio camera need video?

Perhaps it would be a good camera for a wedding photographer. Is 4 fps suitable for shooting weddings? (Serious question and I have no idea of the answer).

Who else is the camera targeted at?

[gstark]

nor is it a crime to be critical of something that appears to me, as a consumer, to be limited in my choices as a system owner.

No, it's not.

But your ignoring (forgetting, avoiding) a number of points here.

First of all, the D800 is clearly not targeted towards you. Nor to me. Not entirely. I love the concept of 36MP (and yes, for once, this is a case where MP do make a difference: we're moving from 12MP to 36MP. While not an order of magnitude, this is a significant increase. I've not done the math, but it's huge, and especially when coupled with the removal of AA filter.

I've used and love medium format cameras, and I've used and love large format cameras. They each are very different tools and provide us, as photographers, with specific characteristics that enable pros to do their jobs. What's been happening for a while is that the lines between MF and 35mm have been blurring for quite some time. The D800 may well remove that line completely; I don't know.

Let's return to the D4 for a moment ...

sorry i dont buy that line. the alternative is spend double ? no sale.

It is not just "an alternative". The D4 is a very different camera system in its own right. It just happens to share the same lens system, but its target demographic is very different, and it is very clearly set to play a big role at the upcoming Olympics. Consider some of its features. Yes, it's fast. Very fast. Not necessarily a good point in a studio camera. Yes, it's supposed to have great low light capabilities. When I'm in a controlled studio situation, with good lighting, do I care about that? Hardly. But perhaps I need to have every last bit of detail from that piece of expensive jewellery?

What about the D4's remote usage capabilities? Do you consider the fact that I can have a D4 sitting at some point, a few hundred meters away, along an athletics running track, but controlled by me through my iPad, to be totally trivial? Especially if that's how my cameras earn their keep?

Let's take a sports publication that sends a troupe of 'togs to a major event; perhaps, again, the Olympics. They will set up their own intranet at this event, allowing their 'togs to show and upload their images, in real time, to their on-site servers. They can have images on the web within minutes, and in this day and age, that's a very serious consideration.

While that sort of capability might not be worth the price of entry to you, to a major sporting publication, it'll be a very small part of the equation.

What I see happening is that the D800 may supplant the D3x.

if you want to do studio work buy a hassleblad.

You were commenting that the D800 is US$3k, and that the D4 is double that, and not (for you) worth the price of entry. What's the current cost of a 'blad digital system? According to the local site, you can start at $16500 for a H4d-31 kit, with an 80mm lens.

For the same investment, I could have a D4, a D800, and a good selection of glass. Plus two high quality video cameras rolled into the bargain. As good as the 'blad might be, I'm not convinced that the 'blad, with just the one 80mm lens, would permit me to turn in better work than the Nikon kit for the same $$$.

[gstark]

serious pro sports shooters will still want 12fps over 6 fps anyway.

The D800 offers up to 6fps in DX mode with the battery grip attached, btw.

Andrew, think of it as being for more deliberate photography, as distinct from off-the-cuff.

In a studio, you may go to great lengths to create a set and set up your shots. You'll spend time getting the lighting just right, etc etc.

If you're shooting a landscape, potentially it's the same deal: you'll be taking your time to get the right location, set the camera up on the tripod, maybe wait for several days for the right lighting/sunrise/sunset.

Speed is rarely of the essence in those situations.

For weddings ... when I used to shoot, I didn't even have a power winder until I bought myself an A1. At even 4fps, if you're shooting with a flash, then your flash's recycle time will probably take you out of the event.

A wedding is a surprisingly difficult event to shoot. There are times when you want high quality with high ISO (in the church, for instance) and other times when ISO 50 may be too high. Different shooters shoot weddings differently - some shoot everything, others won't touch the reception - and thus there's no simple answer to your questions.

But the camera is targeted at pros. In all of their various guises and specialities.