Challenge rules -New rules 21/1

[MHD]

Just storing the rules in a thread that I can keep referencing
Some rules:

*The right is reserved to remove any image not conforming to the rules and denying re-entry to the challenge.

*Images must have been taken using a D70 Body

*Submitted images must have at lest a minimal set of EXIF tags attached that show information critical to eligibility (date, camera etc...)

* Images posted to the Challange site must conform to the theme and/or rules of the specific challenge

*Images must be TAKEN during the challenge time frame

*The format for the comp will be JPEG with the longest dimension no greater than 1000 pixels

* Unless allowed as part of the specific challenge images may not be edited. Post processing is allowed. Allowed actions include: Levels, unsharp mask, cropping, framing, resizing (to the entry size), white ballance, RAW channel mixing (for RAW to Jpeg conversion), cloning for the purposes of removing dust spots or hotpixels, hue sat adjustments including conversion to black and white.

* Only users who are members of D70users.com and who have more than 5 posts may contribute.

* The theme for the next comp will be decided by the winner of the previous one. He/she has two days to come up with a theme or a "random one" will be decided

*Users may submit one image and may not change their submission after it has been submitted

*Some challenges may have prizes associated with them. The rules governing the awarding of the prizes (what placed get what, eligibility (domestic and foreign), tie resolution etc) is will be decided by the donor or agent and their decision will be final with no correspondence entered into (on my part) .

*registration is required to enter and vote in the challenge, users can register by PMing me the following information
-Username preceded by d70 (eg d70MHD)
-preferred name
-email address (required! used to change password etc)

*MOST IMPORTANT: enjoy!!

[MHD]

Variation for rules for comp 3:
Submission will be by email to me (check link below)
Exif MUST be valid...
you MUST ensure there is nothing in the photo or tag that obviously identifies you to more than one of two forum members (so no shots of your wife who eveyone knows or the amazing landscapes of a country everyone knew you were visiting )
I know this is a tough rule but the amazing prizes and tight knittedness of this community demands it... Any questions contact me...

There are plenty of threads on EXIF editing, do a search

Essential flags:
Camera
Date and time of capture (must be set correctly)

Images may be full size

[MHD]

And...

To be elidgable you must have at least minimal location information in your profile...

[birddog114]

And...

To be elidgable you must have at least minimal location information in your profile...

MHD,
Wonderful additional! I like it very much!

[r2160]

Will you be putting the submissions up for display before judging?

I just thought that might be possible to give us a better idea of what is required perhaps?

Glenn
(still feverishly hunting the winning pic)

[Nnnnsic]

To be elidgable you must have at least minimal location information in your profile...

Even me?
My cubicle hasn't been given a postal code yet.

[sirhc55]

What if I shoot someone elses wife? With the camera of course

Chris

[gstark]

To be elidgable you must have at least minimal location information in your profile...

Even me?
My cubicle hasn't been given a postal code yet.

Especially you.

And yes it has.

[Nnnnsic]

Does the entry have to be a single image?

Say if it were a diptych or a triptych presented on a single panel and the EXIF data for each image was included, would that be fine?

[MHD]

ooohhh...

I would say no sorry..

if I cant allow multiple images to get better exposure then I can alow montages... Perhaps in a future comp...

And Panos are also out

[MHD]

Will you be putting the submissions up for display before judging?

I just thought that might be possible to give us a better idea of what is required perhaps?

Glenn
(still feverishly hunting the winning pic)

Yes... IMages will go up as soon as I have a chance to put them up... (usually withing 24hrs of recieving it)

[Onyx]

MHD - would it be a reasonable request that when we forward you our images for the comp, for you to remove the user comment identifying the shooter from the exif field? Or would you advocate each of us individuall doing so ourselves before submission?!

[Oneputt]

MHD - I might be being a little dumb, but have you started to accept entries yet?

[MHD]

Onyx... If you do it early enough yes... but if its left to late no...

say one week before deadline I might start saying no..
Oneputt... submissions are now open

[Nnnnsic]

Now here's a curious question... where does appropriation stand in this... say if someone were to heavily post-process a work, print it, and then copy-stand it and shoot it from the printed image, would that be allowed... and am I just testing the boundaries a bit too much for you, Scott?

[Glen]

Leigh, I would say you are testing (crossing) boundaries Lets see Scott's and others opinion

[phillipb]

My opinion, well and truly crossing the line. That's only a very small step away from photographing someone else's work eg. a painting, and submitting it as your own because you pressed the button.

[Nnnnsic]

Right, now I finally get to use something we had to learn in Uni for my own benefit!

Appropriation is very common in the art world... starting with Marcel Duchamp.. but here are some sources for you to read:
http://www.artlex.com/ArtLex/a/appropriation.html
http://www.duponis.com/magazine/VOLUME1 ... TE-01.html
http://www.othercinema.com/otherzine/ot ... inger.html
http://www.niagara.edu/cam/special/Art_ ... ation.html

Whilst I'm not entirely for this style of art (I do find that I like some of Kruger's work and most people seem to know of the Mona Lisa with the mustache...), my intent wasn't to photograph someone elses work, but to ask, what if you post processed on of your own works, printed it, and then re-shot it. That image would no longer be the same one that was post-processed.

This might raise some interesting points for what is really "original."

[sheepie]

me thinks you've been locked in your cubicle for too long!

you are bringing up interesting points howevere, that no doubt will be tested eventually by someone anyway - especially as the forum gets bigger.

Let's face it - some of these prizes are worth a little bit of 'cheating', so it's worth trying to define what exactly we want before that happens.

To me, if you were to use a picture of a picture as suggested, then it would depend on the way the final pic is composed. If, for instance, the final pic was more a type of 'still-life' including the edited pic, then I think it would be OK. If the final pic was simply to get around the PP rules, then it would not be OK.

[phillipb]

my intent wasn't to photograph someone elses work, but to ask, what if you post processed on of your own works, printed it, and then re-shot it.

That's my point, if the last part of the process is all that counts, then what difference does it make where the original material comes from, it may as well be the Mona lisa or an Ansel Adams.

[Nnnnsic]

But that is the point of appropriation.

I wish I knew what the photo was... I was looking through one of the photography books at Uni and the head photography teacher showed me a black and white shot of an old steel mill... it was something like a brother and sister who'd shot this picture of an abandoned steel mill or something similar... and they won an architecture prize for taking a picture of someone elses work.

Whilst I find that sort of thing disgusting, it still goes to show that there are forces within the art world that will argue that even if you and I were to take a picture of say an Adams work or even one of your works, we could later reclaim it as our own.

I think I just made Scott's night hell.

[phillipb]

Surely there must be copyright laws being broken.

[sirhc55]

I believe that if you photograph a picture of your own work in a new perspective then you are well within the regs of this comp.

Chris

[stubbsy]

Leigh

I find this discussion very interesting and also very reassuring

Interesting because this whole appropriation idea is a complex one I'd never really been aware of.

Reassuring because one of the rules is we musn't be able to identify the author of the work and if you submit an appropriated work we'll all know it came from you and so your shot will be ineligible. Hence I'm reassured that my potentially mediocre work won't be in competition with something so clever

So in this case the answer to your question is moot since the shot will now be disqualified as being identifiable

How do your fingers get breathless???

[Nnnnsic]

Depends on if you've seen the image or not, stubbsy.

For instance, how many images have you seen of mine?

And even if I had the audacity to photograph a work of someone elses, how would you be able to identify it.

That said, it makes you wonder if this "appropriation" idea might be a way to redefine the topic of "a different perspective"... I may have just screwed myself with that one, but I believe I've also made this argument just a bit deeper.

[stubbsy]

Depends on if you've seen the image or not, stubbsy.

For instance, how many images have you seen of mine?

Answer is very few, but my point is that if there is only one image of this type submitted we'll all identify it as being from you. Hung drawn and quartered for a great idea. Brings out my competitive streak

I have to say that I don't have any problems with your idea. In many ways is this any different to say Warhol's soup can or pastiche (not sure of the name) when you cut up photo's and other stuff to use their colours and textures to create an image?

[sirhc55]

To put it bluntly if you go to the art gallery and photograph a Constable hanging on the wall you are representing a work of art in a new perspective - photography

Chris

[Nnnnsic]

That's exactly it...

And stubbsy, I might do it in such a way where it's unidentifiable by me...

In fact, I probably would... I'll make you think yours is appropriated and not mine.

[phillipb]

So if a magazine pays big bucks for an exclusive photo of a superstar and publishes it, I can then buy the magazine, re photograph it at a slightly differernt angle and sell it to another magazine?

[MHD]

Now here's a curious question... where does appropriation stand in this... say if someone were to heavily post-process a work, print it, and then copy-stand it and shoot it from the printed image, would that be allowed... and am I just testing the boundaries a bit too much for you, Scott?

I hate slimy rule benders like you...
:p

The rule is because of this... This comp is a photography comp... if {b}I[/b] judge it (judges rule is open to critisism but only by people the judge likes ) to be photographic work rather than a graphic design work then it will be allowed, but a plain faximilie of a "out of rules post proccessed" image will most definately be disallowed... but say if you PPed an image and it formed an element in a composition for a scene then it mroe than likely will be allowed....

[stubbsy]

And stubbsy, I might do it in such a way where it's unidentifiable by me...

In fact, I probably would... I'll make you think yours is appropriated and not mine.

Now I know how it feels when your brain goes through a black hole

[phillipb]

MHD,
Here are 2 photos, No1 is straight out of the camera - converted from raw to jpeg and resised for web.
No2 is from the same photo. Would you say that it has too much pp for the comp?


No.1



No.2

[MHD]

Well just look at the rules...

To me it just looks like a crop and some levels/curves

So that is good...

[phillipb]

Thanks MHD, that's exactly what I've done.
It goes to show you that you can drastically change the look of a photo and stay within the rules so there's really no need to stretch the boundarys.
Lets keep the within the spirit of the competition.

[MHD]

Spot on....

The simple list of allowed actions is:
Levels/curves
Colour ballance
cropping
cloning to ONLY remove dust and hotpixels
unsharp mask


Actions that are definitalely no allowed unless the specific theme allows:
mixing of exposures
composites/montages/panos
airbrushing

[johndec]

MHD,

Should the submitted image just be the straight picture or are fancy borders allowed?

Personally I think it should be just the pic as a well done/imaginative border can fool the eye and make a pic look better than it actually is.

Your ruling please

[Nnnnsic]

I would imagine no borders as a border essentially comprises of a composite of two images... it may not be another photograph, but it's still another image.

[johndec]

Ummm, just answered my own question. I noticed that 4 images have been submitted so far and they all have various borders/frames.

Looks like it's time to learn how to do borders....

[Deano]

Spot on....

The simple list of allowed actions is:
...
cloning to ONLY remove dust and hotpixels
...

In which case I suggest that the example submitted by Phillipb above is in breach as he has cloned out the debris on the water.

I only mention this in the interests of fairness.

Cheers
Dean

[MHD]

ahh... yes I did not spot that.!

[phillipb]

Oops!, I forgot about that, my apologies. I cloned out the debri before I decided to use this photo as the example.

[xerubus]

quick question..... is there a restriction on the type of content in a photograph for the challenge? i.e. religious, political, nudity, edgy, disturbing etc etc? are we able to push the boundaries?

also... can we get a sticky at the top of this forum with the competition rules... and lock it so that posts aren't added to it? that way the rules are easy to find and can be updated by a moderator etc if need be.

cheers

[sheepie]

... can we get a sticky at the top of this forum with the competition rules... and lock it so that posts aren't added to it? that way the rules are easy to find and can be updated by a moderator etc if need be.

Great idea (if it hasn't already been done) - especially with the number of posts these days, it would be very easy to miss a change being made. Making it a sticky with only a single (or small number of) post/s would make it a hell of a lot easier

Pleeeeaasssse Gary

[MHD]

quick question..... is there a restriction on the type of content in a photograph for the challenge? i.e. religious, political, nudity, edgy, disturbing etc etc? are we able to push the boundaries?

also... can we get a sticky at the top of this forum with the competition rules... and lock it so that posts aren't added to it? that way the rules are easy to find and can be updated by a moderator etc if need be.

cheers

Entries are for now purely at my discression..
Mainly because they will be displayed on a site I have responsibility for..

Dont put anything you would not want a child to see

[MHD]

... can we get a sticky at the top of this forum with the competition rules... and lock it so that posts aren't added to it? that way the rules are easy to find and can be updated by a moderator etc if need be.

Great idea (if it hasn't already been done) - especially with the number of posts these days, it would be very easy to miss a change being made. Making it a sticky with only a single (or small number of) post/s would make it a hell of a lot easier

Pleeeeaasssse Gary

Okay... IN the next few days I will write up the rules and get them stickied

[xerubus]

quick question..... is there a restriction on the type of content in a photograph for the challenge? i.e. religious, political, nudity, edgy, disturbing etc etc? are we able to push the boundaries?

also... can we get a sticky at the top of this forum with the competition rules... and lock it so that posts aren't added to it? that way the rules are easy to find and can be updated by a moderator etc if need be.

cheers

Entries are for now purely at my discression..
Mainly because they will be displayed on a site I have responsibility for..

Dont put anything you would not want a child to see

hmmmm..... okay.... back to the drawing board.

[MHD]

Yeah sorry...

It is compounded by the fact that my stuff is on a uni server so they are god and god must be appeased..

I am looking at moving some stuff (as my page bends the rules of not being commercial) off site (looking into go-daddy) then I might be a bit more open...

[xerubus]

Yeah sorry...

It is compounded by the fact that my stuff is on a uni server so they are god and god must be appeased..

I am looking at moving some stuff (as my page bends the rules of not being commercial) off site (looking into go-daddy) then I might be a bit more open...

no need to apologise... rules are rules...

just means when you go on your other server i'll be able to submit something twice as disturbing

cheers

[gstark]

... can we get a sticky at the top of this forum with the competition rules... and lock it so that posts aren't added to it? that way the rules are easy to find and can be updated by a moderator etc if need be.

Great idea (if it hasn't already been done) - especially with the number of posts these days, it would be very easy to miss a change being made. Making it a sticky with only a single (or small number of) post/s would make it a hell of a lot easier

Pleeeeaasssse Gary

Scott,

If you would care to make the post in a new thread, I our one of the other mods would be more than happy to make it a sticky and lock it up for y'all.

Also, before you migrate to GoDaddy, give me a yell. We'll be doing the same, and I'd like to try to integrate what you've done, plus user galleries, under the one umbrella.

[MHD]

What we might want to look at then is using a content management system...

Just as an example, PostNuke can integrate news, galleries, forums under one user system...

(my system is NOT a good example... my gallery is stand alone... not embedded into PN... I plan to fix it all up one day!)