my blood is boiling...again!

[redline]

well a certain car garage based in qld is running one of my pix on their website. this is the second time i've caught them doing it and let them off with a warning the first time.
thinking of just sending them a bill for image usuage plus for infrigment of copyright as this time their cropped out my name in the image.

how should i go about this?
i've asked copyright.com.au all i got were sales pitches to buy their books.

[PiroStitch]

Not sure mate, but you might want ot check out http://www.copyright.org.au/ instead of .com.au

[Glen]

Redline just send the bill with a standard usage amount, then at the bottom put a note about copyright infringement and if they want to use a photo in future ask or your lawyer will follow up. Follow the invoice up with a lawyer if required. Take a copy of the website before sending the bill

[Catcha]

Wouldn't it be easier to put your name smack bang in the middle of the photo ?

I see this local photographer taking pictures on our Employee of the year night, Had his web site that show the photo's and in the middle of the picture was his name, the Site was also copy protected as in you could not right click and save the picture..Maybe that could be something you could consider........

Oh and great shots by the way....always enjoy your photo's

[redline]

i don't really want to ruin the intergity of my photos by slamming a logo on top

[BBJ]

Thai, mate they will do anything to get hold of your pictures and use as they wish unless you watermark them, i know sometimes it does not look as flash as you might like to but when it comes to shooting what we do they will all ways try get the image. This is why now i use smugmug is that all my motorsport images and watermarked and if they so wish to use a picture for promotional purposes i will supply a jpeg image for there use as long as my name goes on it. If they didn't theive the images there would be no need to watermark but this way it protects you and your images. It is a must im afraid.
Cheers
John

[Catcha]

i don't really want to ruin the intergity of my photos by slamming a logo on top

I mean.... Yeah slam the logo on it but if they want the picture they have to contact you for the picture without the logo.... I think that's a fail safe way.......then you charge them for it if they request it.

[gstark]

Redline,

What Glen said.

Make sure that you do take a copy of the website as it stands right now, and it also might be useful to mark your invoice for a single, non-exclusive use of the image.

[leek]

The Arts Law Council will give you free telephone advice on your rights and remedies... See this thread for further info...

Good luck...

[Killakoala]

The bastards.... Take 'em to the cleaners. You've told them once already, now it's time to get serious. It was your effort to take th photo so you should be compensated for your time.

[boxerboy]

Redline just send the bill with a standard usage amount, then at the bottom put a note about copyright infringement and if they want to use a photo in future ask or your lawyer will follow up. Follow the invoice up with a lawyer if required. Take a copy of the website before sending the bill

On the right track, but send the bill with a lawyer's letter and itemise the cost of the photo along with the legal cost on the bill. You mightn't get paid, but I bet they pull the image and don't try it again.

cheers
Peter

[redline]

nice work, these sobs have decided swap my photo for another photographers image but they still have my image on their system.
not even an email for these ppl.

[sirhc55]

I would also check out if they have any indication of who put the site together, i.e. webmaster or whatever.

The point I am making is that the people who put the site together are also breaking copyright laws. I know this because in my field of work you have to be very careful.

If it has been put together by an outside group it might be an idea to contact them directly and point out they are breaking the law -that normally scares the shit out of designers.

[redline]

how do i find out the webmaster?
when i orginally posted my email to them it got changed very quickly <5hours

[gstark]

OK ...

Now I'm confsude.

On the one hand, you're saying ...

nice work, these sobs have decided swap my photo for another photographers image but they still have my image on their system.
not even an email for these ppl.

Then you go on and say ...

how do i find out the webmaster?
when i orginally posted my email to them it got changed very quickly <5hours

A few things here simply do not gel.


Ok, they've swapped out your photo for another; clearly you've alerted them to the fact that your photo was used without permission, and they've now corrected the situation, but how did they find out that they were using it without your permission?

Read on ...

You say "When you originally posted" your email? To them? But you say that there's "not even an email for these ppl". With no email address for them, how did you send them an email?

It seems that you have this information and have used it; otherwise how could they have acted and removed the image so quickly?


You also say "but they still have my image on their system.".

How do you know this? Do you have access to their system? Do you you know someone who works there?

Given that you're saying that they're a garage, I'm surprised that this action occurred so quickly. My experience is that most businesses are not very web savvy, and certainly, checking of emails is often a low priority.

Acting upon them is an even lower one.

Please don't think I'm coming down hard on you; I just don't understand the full situation here, and some of what you've said seems to be quite contradictory.

The bottom line, were I in your shoes, would be that they have now rectified the problem.

While this may be the second occurrence, I would probably be inclined to let it rest there, but should it occur again, I would first of all take a dump of their website (so you have evidence) and then issue them with an invoice, along with a copy of any of your prior correspondence in the matter.

You are keeping copies, right?

[redline]

nice work, these sobs have decided swap my photo for another photographers image but they still have my image on their system.
not even an email for these ppl.

Then you go on and say ...

how do i find out the webmaster?
when i orginally posted my email to them it got changed very quickly <5hours

i was under the assumption that the webmaster is somewhere higher up the tree and could be held resposblie than a the garage themselves.
correct me if iam wrong

A few things here simply do not gel.


Ok, they've swapped out your photo for another; clearly you've alerted them to the fact that your photo was used without permission, and they've now corrected the situation, but how did they find out that they were using it without your permission?

Read on ...

You say "When you originally posted" your email? To them? But you say that there's "not even an email for these ppl". With no email address for them, how did you send them an email?

i was meant to say that there was NO email from these ppl apologieing to their mistakes they did email me last time but nothing today.

It seems that you have this information and have used it; otherwise how could they have acted and removed the image so quickly?

You also say "but they still have my image on their system.".

if i type in the image file in their dir. it still there

How do you know this? Do you have access to their system? Do you you know someone who works there?

Given that you're saying that they're a garage, I'm surprised that this action occurred so quickly. My experience is that most businesses are not very web savvy, and certainly, checking of emails is often a low priority.

Acting upon them is an even lower one.

Please don't think I'm coming down hard on you; I just don't understand the full situation here, and some of what you've said seems to be quite contradictory.

The bottom line, were I in your shoes, would be that they have now rectified the problem.

While this may be the second occurrence, I would probably be inclined to let it rest there, but should it occur again, I would first of all take a dump of their website (so you have evidence) and then issue them with an invoice, along with a copy of any of your prior correspondence in the matter.

You are keeping copies, right?

yes iam keep copies

[Glen]

Redline, the horse has bolted unless you can put together a html page from your cache.

Personally, as it would be no cost to you, send them an invoice with a covering letter saying a) this is a business for you and you take people stealing your work seriously b) ask if they would like to do the same in future c)please pay the accompanying invoice as you and your solicitor have both taken a copy of the offending page of their website for evidential purposes only and are prepared to go to court to enforce your copyright. This is a bluff, but as they are guilty and you could have, they will not know that.

Don't worry about a solicitor, too expensive just to get a modest bill paid and to tell them to f... off, just follow the above and they will get the message, though it sounds like they already have. If the bill is reasonable I am sure it will get paid as well rather than have any hassle.


ps good luck and ask away if you have any questions. Lets hope they are not in your state, we can start a statement for liquidated damages at the closest court to you and they will have to come to fight it

[redline]

thanks Glen,
i think they let the state afew days ago.
good thing is that they have their mug shots on their website.
has anyone actually gotten money out of a case simliar to this?

[fishingforsquid]

thanks Glen,
i think they let the state afew days ago.
good thing is that they have their mug shots on their website.
has anyone actually gotten money out of a case simliar to this?

More to the point Redline, if it was motor sports, does the driver/team get a cut? Or is it only photographers who have rights?

[redline]

iam not sure what you meant by that.
the photo was used on their site to promote the new vechine. they're weren't selling photos and weren't getting a cut.
As for rights they're all mine.

[redline]

is anyone famliar with sportshooters.com gallery?
it still enable right-clicks but if you try to save it, it comes up clear.

[fishingforsquid]

iam not sure what you meant by that.
the photo was used on their site to promote the new vechine. they're weren't selling photos and weren't getting a cut.
As for rights they're all mine.

I guess what I meant was that in motor sports the cost is not with the photographer but with the machines/drivers. There's been plenty of comment about F1 concerned with colour reproduction (Ferrari). I guess what point I'm making is that the assets are theirs, not sure of your role, sure, I'm not saying you shouldn't get paid for your work but is there an issue with what they believe is their propoerty and what you believe is yours, not sure, just thought I would ask as the people/things on the other end of the lens have ownership also. I prefer to photograph people I know or ask permission (O/S travel) the rest are animals that live on my property and they are happy for me to take their pic, well according to them! Motor Sports is the "sexy" end of photography so not my bag, but they sure are a fiesty litigious lot! Stick with animlas lower down the food chain!

[redline]

I was part of the media chain so photos taken of "their" car belong to me, as there weren't any faces or you could argue that a car has a certain unique individual aspect to it. but on the other end the car sponsors want to see the car perform its best and get "covered" by media hence improving it exposure. its "free" publicity for them, why trash it.

theres only one way to describe this "image thief"

[genji]

is anyone famliar with sportshooters.com gallery?
it still enable right-clicks but if you try to save it, it comes up clear.

check my post in the tips section..i have a script that disables right clicking...but some disagree.......

[redline]

thanks genji,
i got two scripts running on my lastest stuff, but if i leave my mouse cusor over the picture it gives me the download option. anyway of fixing this?

[fishingforsquid]

I was part of the media chain so photos taken of "their" car belong to me, as there weren't any faces or you could argue that a car has a certain unique individual aspect to it. but on the other end the car sponsors want to see the car perform its best and get "covered" by media hence improving it exposure. its "free" publicity for them, why trash it.

theres only one way to describe this "image thief"

I guess I am geting into an area I do not understand or agree.
I thought there was only one meaning to "their" car.
I don't think we can get so precious when the assts are not ours.
The cost of your kit (evenBD'S) pales into insignificance compared to an F1 or whatever you are photographing. The motor sports industry is very agressive, good luck with your law suit!!!!!!

IMO photograph an owl, they don't bite.

[redline]

i thought owls do bite?

[gstark]

i was under the assumption that the webmaster is somewhere higher up the tree and could be held resposblie than a the garage themselves.
correct me if iam wrong

Consider yourself corrected.

Frequently the webmaster is simply a hired gun - not even an employee - and they're rarely very high up the food chain.

Of course, were this a bank, the title would be "Magare, Web Operations", but they'd still be just a minnow in a very big puddle.

i was meant to say that there was NO email from these ppl apologieing to their mistakes they did email me last time but nothing today.

I hope that you're not holding your breath while waiting for one now.

You also say "but they still have my image on their system.".

if i type in the image file in their dir. it still there

That's not very conclusive, I'm afraid. The image may still be in your cache, particularly if you're using IE, or if your ISP has a transparent proxy.

[redline]

i was under the assumption that the webmaster is somewhere higher up the tree and could be held resposblie than a the garage themselves.
correct me if iam wrong

Consider yourself corrected.

Frequently the webmaster is simply a hired gun - not even an employee - and they're rarely very high up the food chain.

Of course, were this a bank, the title would be "Magare, Web Operations", but they'd still be just a minnow in a very big puddle.

i was meant to say that there was NO email from these ppl apologieing to their mistakes they did email me last time but nothing today.

I hope that you're not holding your breath while waiting for one now.

You also say "but they still have my image on their system.".

if i type in the image file in their dir. it still there

That's not very conclusive, I'm afraid. The image may still be in your cache, particularly if you're using IE, or if your ISP has a transparent proxy.

oh i checked it say its directly sourced from their site.
i dunno, i typed in theirwebaddress/images/XXXX.jpeg and my image comes up. pretty sure it not cached

[genji]

thanks genji,
i got two scripts running on my lastest stuff, but if i leave my mouse cusor over the picture it gives me the download option. anyway of fixing this?

thai this is the quote from the website..
" Description: This is a cross browser DHTML script that will prevent the default right menu from popping up when the right mouse is clicked on the web page. Use it to stop surfers from easily saving your web page, viewing its source, or lifting images off your site when using either IE 4+ or NS 4+. Definitely useful for many site owners..."

so it does what it says. the website has this scirpt as a demo and it works.

[Glen]

Fishing for squid, the asset in this case is Redlines image, not the car. Otherwise you could say the track is the asset, as it would clearly be worth more than the cars Redline is photographing. Bottom line, they stole Redline's work, when they should pay for it.


Genji, is it possible to provide a link to the script? Thanks

[genji]

already posted its in the tips and tricks section.

i'm to lazy to repost that link..

[Glen]

Thanks Genjii, I didn't realise by your last message, will follow up there. Thanks

[cordy]

IMO those scripts are a waste of time, if they want the image they are going to get it one way or another. (File, Save As for example)

There are many webpage download programs out there that are designed to do just this and if someone is determined enough they will probably goto these lengths.

Chris