Birddog114 wrote:Aussie Dave,
I love thoseCan I have a back-order with you and pre-paid
no problems Birdy. I'm just waiting on UPS to deliver. So it might be a year or two....or three or four !!!
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no problems Birdy. I'm just waiting on UPS to deliver. So it might be a year or two....or three or four !!! Dave
Nikon D7000 | 18-105 VR Lens | Nikon 50 1.8G | Sigma 70-300 APO II Super Macro | Tokina 11-16 AT-X | Nikon SB-800 | Lowepro Mini Trekker AWII Photography = Compromise
Aussie Dave, I love this too! NC will be free and bundle with Nikon DSLR as same Canon with their software for RAW.  
We do need an activation key for all our camera, yes, it's good point and feature, so someone steals it, it may become useless and you can ring up a toll free number to report: it was lost or stolen so it can't be sold or used to/ by other people same as your mobile phone. 
Hey! Look! it's a wonderful world! Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
Hi Birdy, My reference to Thom was something that he posted within the last 24 hours on the d100 forum, which was about current releases, not his predictions.
Sure, but that is not an issue to me. Adobe doesn't make and sell cameras. They are not a monopoly either. I can and have purchased alternative editing software and will continue to do so when it makes sense to do that. OTOH, Nikon is not a software company. They sell software as an afterthought to selling cameras and lenses. If I were a new buyer, this issue would certainly be a deal breaker for me. Nikon is already free to develop their own competing software, without resorting to encryption and while keeping their proprietary NEF format. But, if they want to compete with other editing programs, they need to do it with comparable features and price, not blackmail. For instance, PSP has millions of users and has a ton of features for photo editing, more and better than Capture, outside of the actual RAW conversion, for about the same price.
If I were a camera manufacturer, my first, 2nd, 3rd, and more concerns would be competing camera manufacturers, not Adobe. The hardware is far more important than the software. Making cameras and lenses is their bread and butter. I can't believe that Capture would be that big of a profit maker for them by comparison. Indeed, it would prolly be cheaper to simply produce a basic RAW conversion application and forget it. The software biz is highly competitive too and Nikon won't compete if they don't dedicate the resources to solving the issues that make Capture less than competitive.
I sincerely hope you're right. I want to initiate my purchases soon. I'm more than willing to let them control my wallet, if they'd just be reasonable on the little stuff...  my gallery of so-so photos
http://www.pbase.com/kerrypierce/
Kerry,
Sorry, I thought you meant about his prediction, yes I've read it and those are his rant same as everyone in DPR which I have seen in the last 24 hrs and each of them has a reason to accept or decline, and they do not have the same view as personal choice and taste.
And Thom is not a Nikon's Saint
Adobe is software company and Nikon is not, but Nikon has the right to develop their own software for their own hardware, can't they? Yes! you agreed! they also have their right to sell their sofware at cheap/ expensive or give away with hardware and no one can stop it. If it's not good or expensive, then don't buy it, or get a cracked somewhere that what lot of people suggested and enjoying your freedom. If you were a camera manufacturer will you give away all your resources which was hard earned by you to your competitors? Of course not. I'm not saying Nikon not wrong doing here but only Adobe has their voice on this issues but not a real sound comes from Official Nikon Office. You may thinking of Nikon is already in bed with someone else as Bibble or PSP or other software developer to compete with Adobe. There's an answer in the day of tomorrow with a sign of "white smoke" come out the chimney Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
Ummm..
Ummm..I'm failing to see the issue here? Unless you own a D2X this makes bugger all difference to anyone! And, as mentioned in the article, if you do own a D2X all this means is that Photoshop doesn't recognise the WB set in-camera..no doubt it will still apply a default or auto setting from which you can customise (which most people do anyway).
When I've taken a whole load of photos I normally adjust the first NEF of a set then apply those settings to the rest of the NEF's. Just my 2c worth (more like 0c since I don't own a D2X!) Liam =]
Re: Ummm..
This will also apply for the D2Hs, and apparently, also for the D70s and D50. It's not yet clear whether the firmware "upgrade" for the D70 will also include encrypted wb as a feature, but Nikon have said that they're including many of the D70s features within that D70 "upgrade". What do you read into that? So the scope of this is far wider than you're suggesting. It may well be the end of civilisation as we know it. Where's Alexander Downer when you need him? What's that? Nobody's ever needed him? I can accept that!  g.
Gary Stark Nikon, Canon, Bronica .... stuff The people who want English to be the official language of the United States are uncomfortable with their leaders being fluent in it - US Pres. Bartlet
Beetleboy,
Yes, you're right! I'm wondering why our D70 owner is worrying about the encryption WB with our current crop of D70 hardware? The population of D2 series's owner on this board is very small about 0.01%, that including myself with D2h and D2x, I did not worry much about in using NEF and PS/ PSCS and I do use that way from day 1. Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
maybe if Nikon decide to encrypt the entire NEF file, they'll give us the option to choose between compressed and uncomressed NEF...or better still, different settings in between ???? Sort of a hybrid NEF/JPEG ???
That way we could keep the quality and PP advantage of NEF, with the option to fit more shots onto a CF card. The disadvantage would be we could only use Nikon Software to read the NEF's.....until the cracks emerged. Unfortunately, we'll never see this happen on the D70.....but one day !?! Dave
Nikon D7000 | 18-105 VR Lens | Nikon 50 1.8G | Sigma 70-300 APO II Super Macro | Tokina 11-16 AT-X | Nikon SB-800 | Lowepro Mini Trekker AWII Photography = Compromise
JordanP, I know that! and I meant population of all range of D2 series's owner not only the D2x Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
Gary
Very perceptive to suspect that the D70 upgrade might encrypt the WB in the EXIF. Surely they wouln't dare? But then...why are they offering this upgrade?Regards
Matt. K
Matt.K
By the time you get your camera back, all will be done by Maxwell for free, sitback and relax! forget the rest and carry on guy! Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
So the moment you try and take a shot, a list of DSLR Users.com Users Online will pop up and tell you how to take the shot with a live image: Mic will tell you that you should be taking a picture of a man... or a woman... or a man... Marcus will tell you to make your mind up. Jethro will side with Marcus. I'll (Nnnnsic) will tell everyone to shut up and just take the bloody photo. Birdy will hold me off and tell you that you might need a new camera before you take the photo. Dad (gstark) will crack a joke about that. And then the server will disconnect and you'll be left to wonder what the hell you were taking a picture of in the first place. Producer & Editor @ GadgetGuy.com.au
Contributor for fine magazines such as PC Authority and Popular Science.
Matt, you may be unwittingly the first test bunny for this upgraded software free of charge from Maxwell after your repair. Let us know what you think of it. Or dont think of it.
Leigh, you forgot Redline saying tilt the camera at 45 degrees and Sirhc55 saying the shot would look better through a coke bottle
At which point Onyx pipes in about Sigmas and then the server disconnects?
Producer & Editor @ GadgetGuy.com.au
Contributor for fine magazines such as PC Authority and Popular Science.
I don't remember there being this much outrage regarding the discovery that lossless compressed NEFs from the D70 aren't lossless at all, that we're only realising 10bits per colour channel instead of the supposed full 12....
Just how many D2X/D2Hs owners are using ACR exclusively as their RAW converter anyways? At the practical level, that's all this issue is affecting.
Matt.k hehehehe! they do you free service and good will and now you complaint! cruel you're! Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
The upgraded firmware will give him a chance to play with some nice features of the new D70s while no ones in the world has it, as of today.
Too harsh Matt.K! Give it a go and you'll be more happy with it Last edited by birddog114 on Thu Apr 21, 2005 10:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
Glen, We were too late! I'm sure they did before Adobe announced! Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
Hmmm. Nikon used to sell me a camera. Fuji/Kodak used to sell me film. I made the photo and could do whatever I felt like with that exposure.
Now Nikon are saying that I need to use their POS s/w to properly develop my negatives AND I still cant get over the fact that they actually CHARGE for that POS! Its bad enough on Windows, but the UI (not to mention performance) feels absolutely horrible on my Mac! Problem is that, to me, Nikon and Canon are the only two real players with decent camera systems. When I first went shopping for a film SLR I had a good play with both. The Canon got picked up and put down again almost immediately. It just didnt feel right in my hands. Every Canon I have picked up since has been the same, including their higher-end models. That leaves me stuck with Nikon. My negative is my property. What and how I chose to use my camera after it leaves the factory is not their business! As for some of the other comparisons people have made. I recently had a discussion with our beanie at work regards MS's digital 'rights' and its longer term implications regards s/w licensing and data ownership. Nikon isnt the only company that has me worried about holding MY data to ransom. Smile; it makes people wonder what you have been up to.
Oh yes they would dare  If you all check out this post at Nikonians:
http://www.nikonians.org/dcforum/DCForumID86/5554.html it appears that the May firmware update will include WB encryption.
Then, what's going to happens?
Get a cracked version and it'll do the job if you don't want to buy it Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
Wanna a try? TIPA award it's Birddog114
VNAF, My Beloved Country and Airspace
that's what will probably happen in real life
Personally, it doesn't really bother me as: 1. I dont work with the kind of volumes that some people do and 2. I find it easier to adjust basic things like WB, exposure,etc in NC and then export to PSCS. If it ever does annoy me, Kazaa and Astalavista are my friends
What's Dribble tell me more? Still new, just getting the hag of it. regards
Darb,
There is a link on here explaining everything. It's something to do with NIkon encrypting their NEF so that third party editing machines can't edit them. Adobe had announced that they wouldn't put NEF to D2X and D55 on CS2 because of imminant lawsuits. Then the firmware update was announced and Gary diabolically threw out the possibility that the new firmware might encrypt the NEF on the old D70. It was quite exciting around here for a couple of days, you really missed out. If you're good at searches, I'm sure you could find the Adobe announcement linked here somewhere.
ok ive been reading in the interim, and gone from moments of panic to elation.
where are we at? 1) is the d70 firmware upgrade going to lock WB? 2) what does this actually mean for me who uses PSCS / ACR, can i still select my white balance, just not access the "as shot" ? 3) Will adobe engineer a new converter, possibly using nikons engine (slower, i know) ... but still allow us to have an ACR style interface? I despise Nikon Capture, with a passion. I have never seen a piece of software eat a couple gig of ram, a xeon chip, and start hammering page file, so quickly ! getting the software is no issue for me, i just hate it, and i have all my NEF to jpeg and processing steps automated in my CS batches / actions etc.
Just in case you didn't find all the links:
Adobe's original announcement. Nikon's Response New D70 Firmware Not confirmed, but a possibility... If it is encrypted in the new firmware, then that's the effect it will have... Maybe... Only Adobe can answer this... Other software suppliers have already decrypted it, so I would say it's likely - but it could cause some legal problems... If you have any concerns, just don't load the new firmware... You can continue to run as you are... Of course - you may find the improvements too tempting (but I guess that was Nikon's intent)... Cheers, John
Leek@Flickr | Leek@RedBubble | Leek@DeviantArt D700; D200; Tokina 12-24; Nikkor 50mm f1.4,18-70mm,85mm f1.8, 105mm,80-400VR, SB-800s; G1227LVL; RRS BH-55; Feisol 1401
John already gave you some of the info. Until the new d70 firmware becomes available, there are no firm answers to your questions, unless you're willing to forget about updating the firmware on your d70. Of course, there is the possibility that some bright, young, software stud will hack the firmware and fix it, should it contain the encryption.... Your current workflow will work fine with your d70. The new PS CS2 and new ACR may or may not support the current d70 NEF the way it is. I've seen nothing on that issue. That may not be an issue anyway, because the new ACR won't work in older versions of PS. AFAIK, it will only work in the new CS2 and the new version of Elements. my gallery of so-so photos
http://www.pbase.com/kerrypierce/
leek ;
If it is encrypted in the new firmware, then that's the effect it will have... so if i did upgrade , and my nef wb was encrypted, what would actually happen if i tried to open the nef with my current CS / ACR ? i would simply have to manually select my white balance? , and not be able to access the as shot, or the predefined WB embedded? By the sounds of all this, we're at some cross roads and it will all sort itself out as time goes on. Just like other aspects of this digital world ... someone does something stupid, and someone else circumvents it ! (i hope, i really really despise nikons software and hope to continue using CS / ACR and/or CS2 / ACR3)
[/b]
That's the way I understand it... You would not have access to the As-shot setting and therefore if you use Auto-WB, the settings used would not be accessible in ACR. You would need to select sunlight / shade / tungsten etc. and then play with the settings... Cheers, John
Leek@Flickr | Leek@RedBubble | Leek@DeviantArt D700; D200; Tokina 12-24; Nikkor 50mm f1.4,18-70mm,85mm f1.8, 105mm,80-400VR, SB-800s; G1227LVL; RRS BH-55; Feisol 1401
cool, that kinda sucks ... but oh well im sure soemeone will let an adobe "ACR" style plugin out on the sly that we can all use.
nikon bloatware sucks. (forgetting the fact its expensive, for a moment.)
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