Copyright Issues???

[Raskill]

Ahoy hoy,

Just wondering if anyone could give me some advice. I'm considering starting my own business (to make this a self paying hobby) with sports photography. I've got the lenses, got some skill (enough, but it's getting bigger) and got a nice backpack.

What I need though is advice on what I can sell, and what I cant. For example, if I take photgraphs at a round of the V8's (I live if bathurst...) am I able to sell those images, or will AVESCO (the V8 corporation) hunt me down and sue me for some breach of copyright? Do they own any images you take at a track if you intend to use them for commercial purposes?

Question2:

If I get good images of amature motorsport or motoX am I able to sell them onto anyone else without the permission of the driver or rider?

Question3:

Taking photos at rugby/league/AFL matches for a particular team (e.g.being paid to photgraph a match by only one team), how do sell the images back to the team, without upsetting the players from the other side (after all, they didnt give permission)?

Hope someone can help me. I would have posted this elsewhere, but don't have 'special permission'.

Thanks.

[Atorie]

if I take photgraphs at a round of the V8's (I live if bathurst...) am I able to sell those images, or will AVESCO (the V8 corporation) hunt me down and sue me for some breach of copyright? Do they own any images you take at a track if you intend to use them for commercial purposes?

You took the photo, you own the rights

If I get good images of amature motorsport or motoX am I able to sell them onto anyone else without the permission of the driver or rider?

Yes, any photos you takes may be sold.. note however if it will be used for advertising use then you will be required to obtain a model release.

Taking photos at rugby/league/AFL matches for a particular team (e.g.being paid to photgraph a match by only one team), how do sell the images back to the team, without upsetting the players from the other side (after all, they didnt give permission)?

You own the rights, they were taken at a public event, but even look at the recent photos of the bec & leyton wedding, there were photos in all the newspapers and trash mags, these shots were not inline with what the couples wishes but they cant stop it...

Just remember however if you are polite and open to your subjects you will gain their trust and respect, gaining greater access to them for shooting..

[MHD]

Read the ticket carefully... some events have you agree to certain things (like no commercial use of any photography at an event) as a condition of purchase...

However almost any photo of anything (note I said almost) can be used for editorial purposes..

[gstark]

Avesco will hunt you down and shoot you.

Yes, absolutely check your tickets - for events like Bathurst and the F1GP in Melbourne, those marketing demigogues, supreme beings that they are, like to be in full control of everything that falls within their spheres of influence, and everything beyond them as well.

If you own a property that faces the circuit, then you probably have rights beyond what Avesco would like to consider reasonable (tough, eh?) but if you're either purchasing a ticket, or have press or photographic credentials for the event, then your rights will be governed by the conditions of entry pertaining to you.

Beyond those sorts of events, whatever happens in the public domain is open slather, subject to model releases, and the Sydney Harbour Foreshores Act (or whever it's called) which limits your rights to use your shots of the SOH and coathanger (etc) for commercial purposes.

[gstark]

You own the rights, they were taken at a public event,

But what defines a public event?

For photographic copyright purposes, an event that is open to the public - for which they are charged an entry fee, such as your typical AFL or NRL match - is not a public event. Note that the event is held behind closed doors, admission is charged, and tickes for admission are required to gain entry.

These are actually private events, to which members of the public are invited to attend.

Check the tiickets and conditions of entry for rights that may be assigned.

Contrast this with a game of footy held at the local oval, where anyone walking (or riding on the bus) past the oval can see the event taking place; this, is truly a public event, and open for you to take your pictures at with minimal restrictions.

[redline]

Ahoy hoy,

Just wondering if anyone could give me some advice. I'm considering starting my own business (to make this a self paying hobby) with sports photography. I've got the lenses, got some skill (enough, but it's getting bigger) and got a nice backpack.

thats nice, where would you like to start? at the top national events or entry level groups?
maybe apply at a newspaper or agency for exp.

What I need though is advice on what I can sell, and what I cant. For example, if I take photgraphs at a round of the V8's (I live if bathurst...) am I able to sell those images, or will AVESCO (the V8 corporation) hunt me down and sue me for some breach of copyright? Do they own any images you take at a track if you intend to use them for commercial purposes?

i think photogs who shoot AVESCO events can't sell the images for other than editonal or prehaps portfolio(not 100% in this either)

Question2:

If I get good images of amature motorsport or motoX am I able to sell them onto anyone else without the permission of the driver or rider?

i think cars are ok bikes if the drivers face is unidentfiable.
most of these ppl would have sign off release forms sayin photos taken at event are or will be used blah blah you get the drift.

Question3:

Taking photos at rugby/league/AFL matches for a particular team (e.g.being paid to photgraph a match by only one team), how do sell the images back to the team, without upsetting the players from the other side (after all, they didnt give permission)?

with amature teams you could approach yourself and ask for permission.
but top end sports games are covered by agencys like gettys and you wouldn't make it pass the door with your 300mm

well if they're upset sell to them as well

[Matt. K]

Selling for "commercial" purposes does not usually prevent you from selling as "fine art". Commercial usually means using the image to promote a brand or a function or an article. Under the copyright laws...which are as grey as hell, exhibiting and selling as fine art probably means you are safe. Get some free legal advice from the Arts Councel, if they're still around. Leigh, (NNNNsic) may be able to give you some contacts there.

[Link]

I'm not sure of the law in Australia for those issues.... A way might be of distributing your images under a pseudonym. It would then come down to whether AVESCO would sue the paper publishing your photos (in this case, the paper would almost certainly end up revealing your identity).

Link.

[Sheetshooter]

Raskill,

You mention that you are hoping to embark upon a business venture with your photography. You will be a specialist in areas for which you have an interest and have amassed some expertise. Just as you would like your credentials to be recognised and your product purchased might I suggest that you in turn purchase the services of another professional - Legal Counsel specialising in INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY.

Publishing has become a litigation minefield and as you would be well aware ignorance is no plea. Dot your 'i's amd cross your 't's and enjoy a hassle-free career. None of us here is a qualified professional fit to offer you any advice at all - we can simply pass on observations or opinions.

Good luck,

[Raskill]

Thanks all, might require some more research and maybe contacting AVESCO to check directly with them (not that they'll offer me anything for free).

Someone raised the issue of press credentials, how would you go about getting those. Is that through AVESCO of the track owners? I imagine they would be much more expensive than I could afford, but i'm just a bit curious.

Thanks for all the advice guys.

[redline]

Someone raised the issue of press credentials, how would you go about getting those.

get a paper or mag job, even dot.coms